http://Thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c108:H.R.3687:


http://Thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c108:H.R.3687:

To amend section 1464 of title 18, United States Code, to provide for
the punishment of certain profane broadcasts, and for other purposes.
(Introduced in House)

HR 3687 IH

108th CONGRESS

1st Session

H. R. 3687

To amend section 1464 of title 18, United States Code, to provide for
the punishment of certain profane broadcasts, and for other purposes.

IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

December 8, 2003

Mr. OSE (for himself and Mr. SMITH of Texas) introduced the following
bill; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

A BILL

To amend section 1464 of title 18, United States Code, to provide for
the punishment of certain profane broadcasts, and for other purposes.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the
United States of America in Congress assembled,That section 1464 of
title 18, United States Code, is amended--

(1) by inserting `(a)' before `Whoever'; and

(2) by adding at the end the following:

`(b) As used in this section, the term `profane', used with respect
to language, includes the words `shit', `piss', `fuck', `cunt',
`asshole', and the phrases `cock sucker', `mother fucker', and `ass
hole', compound use (including hyphenated compounds) of such words
and phrases with each other or with other words or phrases, and other
grammatical forms of such words and phrases (including verb,
adjective, gerund, participle, and infinitive forms).'.

George Carlin, watch out

So... Comedy Central won't be airing the South Park movie unedited then?

This reminds me of that scene from the movie "From the Hip" where Judd Nelson argues with the judge over the admissibility of the word "asshole."

"Your honor, there is no other word in the English language that my client can use to describe the plaintiff as accurately as "asshole."

...or something to that effect.

Yep. This was the funniest thing I read all day. Did you notice who the co-sponser was?

Lamar Smith.

What a coincidence.

oh as if we have nothing better to worry about.

actually universal music claims to have the copyright on all dirty words, that's why they are doing this.

You beat me Mastethom, I was just about to mention that.

While this type of censorship may seem like a noble goal to some, I believe its more of a matter of personal responsibility. If these phrases/words bother you to such a level, then simple turn away from the medium that is projecting them, whether it be an individual, a tv show, a forum, newspaper or anything else.

As for young children, you can always block channels on tv, and avoid purchasing(or secure it somewhere out of their reach) such material. Parents must remember though, eventually their children are going to encounter these phrases/words, whether from a friend, a medium you don't allow in your house that they accessed somewhere else, or some other method.

I know I began using such words when I was in 5th grade, because it was the "cool" thing to do at the time. I never spoke a word of profanity around my parents, as they disapproved of it. So it takes responsibility on both levels, I believe, both the parents and the children.

I was reading recently about a radio host who was charged with slander for calling some slut a "skank" on the air, but he got off because skank wasn't in the dictionary. Heh.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data2/californiastatecases/a094062.pdf

On a side note, most kids are well aware of the words above and probably know a lot worse, so censorship won't do much except make it more difficult for parents to blame television for their childrens' shortcomings

Please consult Amendment 1 of the Constitution and note the freedom of speech part. If any stupid parents uses the "it's corrupting my kids" excuse, please remind them that it's there house, and they shouldn't be letting their kids watch that. They'll then respond with "I can't watch my kids all the time" and you can be clever and say "What, you leave you children alone in the house?"

I am getting sicker and sicker of this administration with every minute.
I think all the words mentioned in that amendment should be applied to the people trying to pass it.

This amended the definiton of the profane language provision...but the scay thing is that, under this legislation...you could get two years in prison for saying these words on a radio roadcast...(but what about a webcast)
"Sec. 1464. - Broadcasting obscene language

Whoever utters any obscene, indecent, or profane language by means of radio communication shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both "



I just watched Carlin's concert from the 70s about the dirty words....
I noticed tits and fart are missing from this one...

Someone should send this to Carlin.

Everyone seems to be missing the fact that this only applies to radio broadcasts. Speaking strictly as a parent, I don't see the big problem. I can turn on the TV, and check the content of something before allowing my kids to watch. I can't use my Miss Cleo powers to discern when the DJ may choose to blurt out, "Motherfucker", so I'd just as soon he didn't.

It's a little different than leaving my kids unattended to watch whatever comes on Skinamax, and then complaining that they saw something I didn't want them to.

I agree that parents bitching about what kind of music their kids listen to is ridiculous, especially since a lot of those same parents are providing the money for them to do so.

I agree that parents who use the tv as a babysitter are gonna end up with kids who know more than they might want them to, and it's their own damned fault for not actually parenting their child.

But, I do pay attention to what my kids watch, the music they listen to, and the video games they play. I don't expect the government, or society, to parent my children. If it's something I don't feel is appropriate, they don't get it. I know their friends' parents, and I make sure they are aware of what games/music/movies are off-limits. If my kids are exposed to something I don't approve of through my own negligence, that's one thing.

But at the same time, I shouldn't have to worry about the DJ on the radio station deciding it's appropriate to call someone a cunt or a motherfucker(even if they happen to be one), and having to explain that to my nine year old.

Why is this a problem, you ask? Because not everybody shares your feelings. What if you were thinking during the early 1800's "Why should I care what happens to the other Native Americans?" and you were a Native American? They'll get to you soon. And then your gonna be wishing you had cared now.

As for this law, they forgot dick, bastard, bitch, and a few others I can't think of right now.

Freedom of Speach. It means that I can say whatever the fuck I want, so **** off.

Captaind... Hail, Lenny Bruce!!

Paraphrasing....
~All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good men to do nothing.~
~Code

Paraphrasing....
~All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good men to do nothing.~
~Code

The only thing worse than giving up...

is giving in.

Evil triumphs when good men who can fight, give in.

Question: Does this apply only to DJ's saying the words, or does it include the music played as well? I ask because I currently have a show on college radio that falls in the Safe Harbor period between 10 PM and 6 AM in which certain "indecent" material can be played, but not spoken by the DJ (something about the song being art, but a DJ not being an artist, or something along those lines). I'm curious as to whether I could go to jail for playing something with one of those select words in it (a few of which are currently allowed during Safe Harbor periods).

Censorshit strikes again. Next thing you know if we cuss in our house, SWAT teams will bust through our windows and take us away.

God, i love amerikult's gov't village idiots

in no way is shit a profain word, or a 'bad word'.
err isn't this a violation of the first?

a few words for the people who support this bill....
Fuck off you fucking ass raping ass holes, go climb back into that ass cunt that you fucking came from, you little piss holes, go fuck with your mother fucking freinds you cock sucking bastards! issed:

whoops I think I hit all of ther 'bad words'

missed asshole

They want to ban curse words. How about banning explicit sexual stuff on TV (Britney and Madonna kissing springs to mind)

"So... Comedy Central won't be airing the South Park movie unedited then?"

to the best of my knowledge this refers to broadcast TV, not cable, so South Park is in the clear.

Good article Googled up here...

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/01/09/DIRTYWORDS.TMP

It gets me that people like Ose say, "I don't want to be sitting there when a guy blurts something out over the TV and have my daughters (11 and 9) ask me what those words mean.''

too freaking bad do your job as a fucking Parent!!!

You don't have to explain what a Donkey-Raping-Shit-Eater is, but you can explain to your child that there is language that is not suitable for mixed company.

"1984 has passed, forget about Big Brother. Welcome to the nineties where the government's your Mother"

~'Goodbye Freedom, Hello Mom' - Scatterbrain

ya know the REALLY obscene words ?

The words that leave thousands of men and women dead and/or crippled on foreign shortes...lies and empty promises....high sounding goals which camouflage greed and base agendas....

Really obscene words are those like those that ooze forth from the mouths of people like Cary Sue, branding people as pirates when they aren't even convicted of copyright infringement.

I hear a lot of obscene words coming from politicians....but, a lot of them are not your stereotypical curse words....but of course, a lot of presidents have been real masters of cursing....

take Lyndon Johnson. I had an older gentleman I became an acquaintenance of that used to be the helicopter pilot for the late LBJ....he told me Johnson could hardly say five words in private without a torrent of cursing....

Take Gen. George Patton, played so dramatically by George C. Scott. Remember that scene in the movie where he was standing in front of that giant flag and talking to the troops?

I knew a guy that was actually there when this speech happened. He saw the movie version and told me that was a real joke...there was none of the inspirational crap..the guy said Patton came out, and cursed them for everything he could think of from the beginning of the speech to the end....

And, as for cursing in general....I don't know of anyone who has worked in any industry...tech, medical, law, you name it...who hasn't been around curse words just about every day they go to work.

Now, I am not for exposing anyone, let alone children, to hard core curse words if they are deeply offended....but, it reminds me of the story of Buddha. Buddha was a prince who had never been exposed to the sight of anything ugly...he had never seen a poor person, never seen an old person, never seen a diseased person. One day , he got outside of the palace and saw an old person. He was horrified...he didn't know what to make of it....

Exposure to curse words is like exposure to microbes...you need some exercising of your immune system from time to time to keep it in tune...and I guess, if someone is going to eventually live in the real world, it doesn't hurt to be exposed to these kinds of words.

One cannot insulate people from everything that may offend, upset, aggravate, excite...etc..

The first amendment is one of the most important parts of our freedoms....
The problem with making use of "certain words" a crime, punishable by prison time, is that it sets up a slippery slope...
you start with banning things on the radio...then on televison....then in books...and on and on.

meant foreign shores...not shortes

1st the speech police 2nd the thought police 3rd the what you wear in public police. Can someone tell WHY our brave troops are fighting overseas FOR????????????

That bill is funny.

Sorry for the double post.

As always, spot on Code. This... is an outrage.

First it starts with insulating people from what offends them(Vice City has been changed so that one of the gangs is not Haitan). Then it goes onto banning books, then it goes on to burning books. Then we are living in 1984/Farenheit 451.

I never thought i would have to screen the U.S. Code for profane words in so my kids can read it. Maybe it is time lawmakers give these laws themselves censorship ratings.

CodeWarrior said: "ya know the REALLY obscene words ?

The words that leave thousands of men and women dead and/or crippled on foreign shores...lies and empty promises....high sounding goals which camouflage greed and base agendas...."

Couldn't agree more Code. You know what the newest obscene word is? It's really a number not a word. 500. Now that's obscene.

http://www.militarycity.com/valor/honor.html

You know what really needs to be done? An organization called 'Fascists for the Repeal of Freedoms' or something like that needs to be set up. They need to be VERY vocal in their support for everything that's ruining America...RIAA lawsuits, DRM, the Drug War, Patriot Acts, etc. They should work hard at using the flimsiest of arguments to support all these things, and get maximum exposure doing it - all in the name of "easing America into what's really best for everyone - Fascism!" However, they should be careful to deny any accusations of sarcasm...they should swear with all fury that they are dead serious (gotta make use of the same fear stick the govt uses, you know?). That should shine some light into the dark holes some of these evil bastards crawl out of to impose their morality and twisted greed on everyone else. And how can they attack an organization that so clearly and passionately supports everything they do? Hehe...scandalize the evil-doers with support!

If anyone wants to run with this, let me know. I'd love to do it...

It's time for educated democrats like most of ourselves to take this country back from ignorant republican bastards who rape and pillage the middle class while they laugh about outsourcing American jobs and leave their companies not giving a shit about what happens to it or the people that work for it.. Look at IBM and Lou Gershner, screwed over employees, ripped their pensions away, closed down the original IBM plant in Endicott, New York all for capital gain.. He or any other CEO couldn't give a shit less about what the company was founded on... T. J Watson is probably rolling in his grave right now.. IBM at one time used to actually help their employees purchase houses, gave them free medical benefits, gave them lifetime pension plans after 30 years, treated their employees like kings and now look at IBM.. Screwing people over as much as possible.. That's why there is an age discrimination lawsuit against IBM because they stole people's pensions, and or fired them only a year away from recieving pensions... Makes me sick... Boycott American... I buy japanese or german as much as possible... they actually treat their employees fairly and at the same time, especially with cars, produce vehicles that aren't steaming peices of shit on four wheels. If an American company can save 10 cents on a cheaper part that will sacrifice the quality of the car they will do it for their CEO's bottom lines.. Boycott American.. and don't call me unpatriotic, if you want to talk to someone about being unpatriotic, talk to the typical cheap assed American Corporation screwing it's employees while sacrificing quality for their bottom lines.. An example, look at chevrolets new campaign, "An American Revolution", have you seen some of these new cars? they look like pieces of shit, and to add injury to insult a couple of the cars are actually contracted out and made in Korea... I'll stick with my Acura thank you... It won't fall apart after 35,000 miles due to a blown head gasket like it's American counterpart.. The truth hurts, doesn't it?

Yet another reason why I am moving to Canada after college.

Goddamn, why are people so up in arms about "curse words"? They just words! Big fucking deal, you testicle-shitting rectal warts! (Thank you, Terrance and Philip.)

The only difference is that they have stronger emotion attached to them than their "clean" counterparts. The only reason that you have these people so shocked by them is because society tells them to be shocked. And then you have these idiot 7th and 8th graders using the words repeatedly as though they're trying to impress somebody.

And what is with the bleeping out of words? Most everyone knows what word is being bleeped out, and those who don't will figure it out eventually. Why must these bible-humping conservative Republicans declare everything that they don't like and find offensive to be so wrong? They're the ones who are wrong! They need to stop clinging to the ways of old and admit that there very well may not be a God.

Sonic touched on something I've thought for a long time now "Goddamn, why are people so up in arms about "curse words"? They just words!"

I remember a time when we could turn on the television or radio and all we heard about was how Bill Clinton inserted a cigar into Monica Lewinski's anus. Perfectly acceptable to speak of on the airwaves, but God forbid you say "Bill Clinton f*cked Monica up the @ss with a cigar", you'd be strung up by the balls...errr...I mean testicles. Dr. Ruth can go on the air and talk about a man's penis, but not his "cock" or "dick" because that's not acceptable. Now tell me honestly, what's the difference? Both ways of saying it have the exact same meaning, just said using different words. What next? We have to say "automobile" because somebody for some insane reason deems "car" to be an offensive word? Will we be forced to say "writing utensil" because somebody becomes outraged at the use of the phrase "ink pen"? I'm offended because whenever the phrase "God damn" is uttered on tv they always blank out the "God" but let the "damn" be said. So we can hear the actual "curse word" of the phrase and that's acceptable, but don't you dare say "God", we can't have God on our airwaves! The words are not the problem, the problem is the message and/or intent behind the words that are being used. (Yes, this is an idea that was planted in my head by George Carlin long ago, but one I firmly believe.) The sooner people realize it's the intent and not the actual words the sooner we'll be able to get to some real solutions for real problems rather than have our time wasted on some load of crap like this. And on a final note, this kind of reminds me of a conversation I had with my girlfriend's son a while back. He complained that he didn't like a phrase I used on a somewhat regular basis. Nothing offensive, can't even remember what it was anymore to be honest, but for some reason he told me to quit saying it because he didn't like it. My response to that was if everybody had to quit saying everything that somebody else didn't like the only words we would be left with in the English language would be a, and, & the.

I think this is a great idea! I have never used one of these words or phrases in my life and I never intend to. At last, mabye America will regain some moral decency.

ElChina. oddly enough, there IS such an organization. It's called something like "People against UnAmerican Activities" or something like that. They have an office in Lebanon Nh, and they have a big sign that changes weekly or so extolling the sins of the current "regime" I'll try to get the EXACT name of the group, but if I'm not mistaken, they are basically what you're talkin about.
I have to say I am oddly non chalant about this issue. I do'nt have kids, never had so I'm not going to flame parents. Hey, whatever you do, you know you'll have to answer for it eventually, so I'm NOT the one to say it's wrong or right. I know I started using most of these words as early as the 5th or 6th grade, and got some trouble when my folks found out, but that was because they didn't like it.
I have to agree that with life, comes the good and the bad. I personally am guilty of using every one of these phrases, both in print and in speaking, but I know when to say what. I've never called my boss a f**ing a**h** (to his face anyhow), and I'll never say in a meeting that we should .."..get the motherf**ers to do more work".
Slaughterhouse Five. The Shining. It. Are you there God it's me, Margaret. The Holy Bible. These are all books that have burned or banned because of content, and at least some of these books use the exact language this bill makes it illegal to use on the air. (fatchucks.com has a pretty comprehensive, tho not all inclusive list). Who decides what's wrong or right? Where was the due process to find out if the American people actually WANTED or NEEDED a law like this?
I'd kind of like to know who STARTED this bill, as it seems to have been snuck in under the radar. I'd like to see it removed or struck down, not because of my kids (none) or because of my sensibililties (some say I have none), but because of the freedoms this makes a travesty of.
ttmmm

ThetaPhi,
A worthy opinion but I must ask ..
Who is "Moral" enough to decide for me
or anyone else what may or may not be
said ?

I decide for myself, I help my kids
( twin 13yr old girls ) decide by talking
to them and answering their questions
in the best way I can. An earlier post
mentioned that attempting to insulate
them totally is not a good idea. I
Heartily agree with that notion. Kids
need to learn how to deal with the negative
aspects of life, and that is where parents
come in. Not a school, government, or
anyone else that thinks that my way of
living is not "Moral" enough for their tastes.

Ok, so let me see if I have this straight, Craig.

If I let my kids listen to Eminem, and they start using a bunch of language I don't like, it's my fault for not doing my job as a parent.

If I screen what my children watch/listen to/play, so that they aren't exposed to that stuff, yet the DJ screams out motherfucker, and my child picks it up, that's my fault, too?

Bullshit. My job as a parent is to sort through what my children can and cannot listen to/watch/play, because it is not appropriate for them. Someone else making those decisions for me is not acceptable.

And I can guarantee that the school wouldn't care where they heard it. Kids repeat what they hear, especially when you tell them not to (at least at 9 & 12, they do). The school sure as hell wouldn't be calling up the radio station. No. They would call me. Let me know when you have children, honey. Then come talk to me about how to do my job.

TPO - It has nothing to do with moral decency, as far as I'm concerned. It's common sense. Most people I know are listening to the radio when taking their kids to school, daycare, etc. Most school buses play the radio, a lot of different businesses (store in the mall, etc.) have a radio playing.

I can choose not to use those words, and not to let my kids listen to music or watch movies that contain them. But if the DJ is shouting them out over the airwaves, then that is taking away my right to choose, along with everyone else's.

Code - I'm sure people will say that I can just change the station. Well, who's to say that the DJ on the next station won't be doing the same thing?.

In all actuality, it's sad that they have to legislate something that should be common sense, if not common decency. Of course, both of those terms have become oxymorons in our society.

Would you walk into your mother's house and yell, "Hey, Motherfuckers, I'm home!"? Probably not. It's about speaking with respect.

Do you think that is would be ok for the receptionist at the doctor's office to say, "Can you hold, asshole?" Probably not. The only difference is, she doesn't have a mike and antenna. DJ's do. I don't invite the doctor's receptionist into my home. I do that, in essence, with the DJ whenever I turn on my radio.

And for freedom of speech, I suppose that means that the DJ can start spouting racial or religious epithets, too? I mean, I can't wait to turn on the radio to hear the DJ call someone a stupid fucking Heeb, or motherfucking nigger. Won't that be a great day for freedom of speech?

People don't seem to understand that our forefathers didn't give us that freedom so that we could run around shouting obscenities, looking like a bunch of idiots. It was so that our government could not stop us from speaking out against it. So that we could not be silenced for espousing unpopular opinions. I seriously doubt that it was so we could call people motherfucking assholes on the radio.

And, actually, according to the morning DJ (Dave Smiley, Z99.5, Indianapolis) on the station I listen to, they could already be fined and jailed for it, this is just making the definition more specific. As the law currently stands, "bitch", "bastard", and several other words that have been pointed out as not being on that list, are actually included, and can carry fines for their use. So this actually shortens the list of words currently considered "profane".

Mtekk- Profanity is the common crutch of the conversational cripple. The occasional well-placed curse word can serve to emphasize a point, but a stream of foul language just makes it seems like you're too stupid to make an argument using the rest of the English language. I'm sure your mother is so proud.

At a certain point on this board, actually, pursuant to the first posting of John316...I made a decision to try to keep my conversation as clean as I could in the sense of not using most of the common curse words...I did this out of respect to him, and to anyone coming to this board who was of a younger or more sensitive nature. I am here to motivate and inform, and to learn from others, not send people away. I've been to boards where it is a constant flame and tirad of F this, MF that, and on and on. Not pretty, and in the long haul, not productive. I was a "PK" or preacher's kid. I didn't even get to use the word "heck" and didn't even KNOW most of the cursewords and given my naivete, I can recall a kid in school asking me what word started with F, and ended in "UCK"...not knowing the word was bad, or even that it existed, I said the F word loudly... and all the other kids started laughing at me...his answer...no...Firetruck.

I don't try to impose my "moral" standards on everyone else. That is a form of social tyranny in my opinion.

Curse words only have the power you give them..i.e. if you share the belief that MF is forceful or threatening, it is usally because the expletive implies, in many instances, the threat of violence if it is directed at you.

I speak Spanish, a little German, and Chinese...the curse words in those languages are not the same words, but you can get the same reaction from the people who speak that language....my point being it is the intent of the words, and the reason you use them that gives them meaning.

Recently, you may recall that the use of the F word by Bono, was ruled as NOT a violation of FCC standards on TV, because he apparently was not referring to the sexual act. Again, we are dealing with intent.

The thing that is bothersome to me, is making some part of free speech, not free anymore, and something that you can be imprisoned up to two years for.

Deciding that some words are criminal in and of themselves, if used in one medium and not another, is not only legislatively hypocritical, but dangerous in the sense that it gives the IMPRESSION of a country creeping toward establishment of a theocracy, and, as we are supposed to be opposed to the notion of a theocratic government which restricts personal rights, as Iran was accused of during the hostage crisis...this is something to be concerned about.

I spoke earlier of the slippery slope and I believe we are establishing one here. Today, it is the F word, the MF word, the C word...and others, on the radio...next...it could be applied to TV cable...then to movies...etc.
This is a beach head, a precedent....

Do I want people hollering F this, or "You MF" on the radio?
NO. But, do I want to hear a lot of the crap that Limbaugh or Michael Weiner (aka Savage) says? NO...but I can change the channel.

Jynnantonix- I respect your concern for the kind of language your children are exposed to. You say something about changing the channel, but ask how do you know the next DJ is not going to do the same...I think that what would emerge is that there would be a few stations that would adopt such a broadcasting format, but they would be few and far between, because radio lives and dies by their sponsors, and "family oriented" products will shy away from offending people by sponsoring such stations. There would be a slew of Howard Stern type shows wanting to cash in on the titillation factor, but cursing loses its "charm" (power) with overuse. If you ever listen to someone that curses alsmost every other word, it gets OLD really fast.

Something that is very interesing to me is that, when people talk about cursing, they often DO bring the point up about use of curse words indicating a poverty of ones language...I think by all accounts, people would have to admit that William F. Buckley has a great vocabulary...but once on his show, someone accused him of being a Nazi...and he flew into a rage on a show and started cursing...I've found that cursing doesn't necessarily mean a person has a poor education or vocabulary, but they have reached an emotonal boiling point at which nothing but curse words will suffice to act as a verbal attack method, or release valve.

I curse occasionally, but not in public. And, I believe that cursing by the yound is at an epidmic stage (perhaps influenced by "Slim Shady" and the other rappers who overflow with expletives on their records)...but passing legislation making certain words shibboleths by law...that's a dangerous measure to me.

Respectfully,
~Code

typo---cursing by the yound was meant to be "cursing by the young"

Addendum...if you ever watch a movie that HAS curse words, and see how it is when the censor it a lot, overdubbing the original words...you can see who ridiculous it gets.
One of my fave movies is Glengary Glen Ross (I may have spelled wrongly)
and I've seen it in the uncut version and in the "sanitized" version. The sanitized version is a farce, it rips the guts out of the movie, because these guys WOULD curse. It also distorts the character Alec Baldwin plays...since part of his aggressive character is his aggressive language.

Thus, it really ruins the movie for me...

Whichever colorful words I choose to use or not use is my choice. By making laws that choose for me, the freedom of choice becomes less and less. Granted, this isn't aimed at me YET, so far just at broadcasts, but how long until it's illegal for me to say "shit"? Our rights and freedoms are going away one by one, slowly enough that many people never notice. One day we will wake up and realize that we do not live in the land of the free any longer.

This is just my thoughts; people should definately have the right to live in whatever environment they want. If you here don't want censorship, you should be able to live without censorship. However, there are many others who do want offensiveness censored, and I believe they too should have that right to live that way. We all are going to die equally, might as well be able to live life how you want to.

Neither group's beliefs are more or less important than the others, and that's where the real conflict comes.

You can have everything your own way, that's just the reality of living in a society. I don't mind this amendment if it applies only to broadcasts over the airwaves, because I'd consider it a sign of repect towards others. The air is part of the public domain and as such should be subject to the will of the people on a whole. And we still have cable tv, print newspapers, internet radio, dvd's, etc. that can still use "cursing" without the same restrictions. Now if the government wanted to apply this law to those alternate forms previously listed, then I would definately be outraged.

That's just my view.

er... "you CAN'T have everything your own way"

Code - Some great points, thank you.

The poor vocabulary comment was truly meant entirely for mtekk, who didn't seem to be angry, but more like they just wanted to sound cool.

I agree that some stations would go for the shock value, and some wouldn't. But, history shows us that the more we are exposed to, the more it takes to get a reaction. Like crime scene techs. I'm sure the first one they work makes them want to puke their guts up, but as they work more and more, it becomes less and less repulsive. And, if there was nothing telling them it wasn't OK, where is the incentive to NOT do it? I think that the more stations that did it, the more stations would jump on the bandwagon.

I agree with the point on editing movies, though. That whole, well-placed curse word thing, again. It isn't as effective without it.

But on the other side, let's remember that this isn't some new law. This is a proposed modification of an already existing law. It is already illegal for them to say those things. It's just that as it stands right now, there is no definition of what is considered, "profane".

As I said earlier, there have been radio stations fined (although I've never heard of anyone being jailed over it recently) because of the use of the word, "bitch", which wouldn't even be included in the new definitions.

I know that doesn't appeal to people like tasader, who think that freedom of speech means they can say whatever they want. (Yeah, go yell, "Fire" in a crowded movie theater and see how far that argument gets you.)

The point of Freedom of Speech is to guarantee that we are allowed to speak out about our beliefs, to question our government. It is about making sure we don't turn into a bunch of party-line spouting automatons. I just don't believe that a DJ not being allowed to say Motherfucker is a huge imposition on their 1st Amendment rights. Especially since they are already not allowed to say it without being fined or risking jail time. What exactly are they losing?

Actually, I really would like to read anyone's thoughts on my own comments; because I just think that you can't really learn much if everyone's opinions are the same, gotta understand both sides & then pick apart the good & the bad.

If I'm in a crowded theatre and someone sees it's burning, I hope they yell fire...I would.

Jynnantonix,I understand and appreciate your well articulated thoughts, but honestly, to me, the first amendment is indeed a broadly defined right to free speech, and includes the right to say the words you have want to.
The "hollering fire in a crowded theatre" usually assumes there is no fire, and the court decisions on this and other limitations, are post hoc to the framing of the Constitution. As you know, curse words are not new...they had curse words in the 1700s, and I can assure you, that Ben Franklin (a member of the "Hellfire Club"), and his contemporaries, who wrote the constitution,based to a large degree on Native American agreements, used these curse words from time to time.

My point in this is that, they knew there were curse words, but did they include in the First Amendment any prohibition against "oath taking" or cursing? Nope. Thus, ,my interpretation of this omission of any prohibiton against "filthy words" indicates to me that they did not intend that these words were verboten.

I personally feel the Supremes (not talking about Diana Ross ) have thus incorrectly made rulings about the obscene word business.

What does the First Amendment say?
"Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. "

Congress shall make no law....abriding the freedom of speech.
Abridging is limiting, shortening, making it smaller...thus, clearly,
Congress according to the First Amendment, is meant to be prevented from messing with freedom of speech. Clearly, verbal emission of expletives are speech, and freedom is a word which implying lack of restraint.

The Freedom of Speech afforded by the 1st Amend., has been limited and hamstrung by court cases and decisions...and usually, by virtue of the government's belief that they have the right to regulate what goes on the public airwaves...but they've decided to regulate it with regard to the use of certain "words", but not with regard to some others. For example, when I was growing up, the word "damn" was a curse word and something I could not utter. But, you hear "damn" on the public airwaves, both on radio and TV.

The notion that someone could be imprisoned for use of the MF word, is to me, bizarre and draconian.


You may be aware that Howard Stern's station had to pay a record fine imposed by the FCC for what he said...did it shut him down or the station down? Nope. I don't like Stern...although I saw his movie Private Parts...
to me, the term "Shock Jock" applies to him because he says words for effect in my opinion, and not just as a normal part of his colorful way of speaking.
Personally, I find the opinions he utters much more offensive than the curse words.

I agree that the more people are exposed to curse words, the more oblivious they become to some extent. But, let's take someone like comedians Richard Pryor and Eddie Murphy. On one of Eddie Murphy's concerts he talked about
Bill Cosby calling him and chastising him on using blue words. Murphy said he called Pryor about it and Pryor asked him if people laughed when he used them...he told Pryor yes, and Pryor told him to tell Cosby to drink a coke, get a smile and shut the F up.

A lot of comedians use profanity to great effect. Some of my fave comedians,
Sam Kinison, Pryor, Lenny Bruce, Robin Williams, use profanity for its humor value.

You're right, this law has been on the books, and the amendment merely clarified or added to the other law. I'm saying the law it amended was wrongheaded.

Defending offensive speech is the most important part of freedom of speech to me. If everyone spoke like Miss Manners, or Mr. Rodgers, we wouldn't need this law....but, to be honest, I would hate to live in the kind of homogenized world that would ensue.

Let's take the four letter word meaning excrement. SH*T.
I've notice an evolution of that word such that these days, a lot of people use it to mean "stuff", e.g. "Before we leave, did you get all your sh*t".

I understand the word is also one of the most common last words people utter when they see impending disaster on airline black box tapes....
as in "Oh..Sh*t"...so in a way, the word "sh*t" has lost its power....

As I said, I try to keep my language here restricted, and thus, a self imposed loss of Freedom of Speech, in respect to you, your kids you may want to show the page to, the ladies on board, or anyone who visits who may not enjoy it. And, I encourage others to be circumspect as well...but, do I think there should be a law restricting the free exercise of speech, or religion, or association, Nope! I kinda think Jefferson would be spinning in his grave to read this law.
~Code

I don't thnk yelling "fire" in a crowded room is freedom of speach, because it could potentially PHYSICALLY cause damage to people.

Also, the Forefathers of this country didn't "grant" us Freedom of speach as if it were a treat. They granted us the ability not to fear the government if we say something that the current government doesn't agree with.

Honestly, have you ever seen somebody who was physically being hurt by words?

correction:
Honestly, have you ever seen somebody who was physically being hurt by "curse" words?

tasadar....great point...we supposedly have unalienable rights at birth by our Creator....the first and succeeding amendments are actually protections against the gov trying to take away our rights...

but, honestly folks..if you and I are in a crowded theater..and see a raging fire...and I don't ...PLEASE LET ME KNOW ABOUT IT...

Jynnantonix~ when you say

"Bullshit. My job as a parent is to sort through what my children can and cannot listen to/watch/play, because it is not appropriate for them. Someone else making those decisions for me is not acceptable"

and

"I agree that parents who use the tv as a babysitter are gonna end up with kids who know more than they might want them to, and it's their own damned fault for not actually parenting their child"

I don't understand how you then seem to support this law. The government is now making the decisions and doing the parenting for you???

I'm not saying that everyone should start cursing up a storm on radio stations and tv stations like Fox and ABC CBS and NBC.

It seems to me, as someone who is not a parent, that your kids ARE going to hear all those dirty words if they haven't already. To depend on the government to try to keep it from happening WILL NOT WORK. To me the best approach seems to be to "explain to your child that there is language that is not suitable for mixed company". Or wash their mouths out with soap, lord knows I got my share

on a side note~ why do we need a new law? As people have pointed out there are existing laws on the books to fine and jail them them for failure to comply. To ammend a 56 year old law to reflect 7 words currently deemed naughty is foolish. Is the law going to be revamped every year to reflect today's curse words? Do you think today's list would be the same as 56 years ago?

I think this law will be shot down real quick, but I look forward to seeing the debate on cspan where they will read the list of words that you ummmmm... can't say on cspan.

I...(paranoid) see this law branching out in the future. First it's MF, next it's nazi-tactics, then its regime, and finally we can't say F* you gov't.