Who are the Pirates anyway?

By Zeek Groko

It seems to me that every few days there's yet another article on the web about the recording companies trying to bring rampant pirates to justice. I think the RIAA's idea of justice might be a little one sided and a double standard. Fact is, the recording companies have been flying the Jolly Roger since day one. They've been perpetrating an injustice on all consumers of their products for decades and I see no indication they're going to correct it.

There's is a scene in the original movie "Men in Black" where Tommy Lee Jones and Will smith are at the alien receiving center, in the alien technologies room. Tommy Lee Jones is showing Will Smith these new technologies and he picks up what looks like a one-inch CDROM for playing music and says "I guess I'll have to buy the Beatles White Album again".

Using this example, why is Tommy Lee Jones saying "I guess I'll have to buy the Beatles White Album again" ? He obviously already owns it, the word "again" indicates that. What he's really saying is, "I already have a full license to listen to and enjoy the music that is on the Beatles White Album that I now have on CD. But things being what they are with the greedy, pirate recording companies, in order to get the Beatles White Album on this new one inch disk medium, I'll have to buy another license as well. Come to think of it, being as old as I am, I paid for a full licence for the original 12-inch vinyl LP, the Eight Track Tape, the cassette and the CD. No, wait ! I just remembered. I bought the eight track twice and the cassette three times. Those old tape players ate a lot of good music." In this scenario you might expect Will Smith to ask:

1) Isn't there a way to return the CDROM and pay for just upgrading to the new one inch medium ?

A)The record companies have at no time in the past nor are they likely in the future to (without buyers boycotting) implement any form of new media format exchange program.

2) What happens if the cd cracks or gets scratched,(which is hard to avoid) can you get it replaced or do you have to buy a full license every time?

A)You're out of luck, you have to buy a full license every time.

3) Is there any way to make a backup? That way you can store the original in a safe place and replace the backup when it becomes unplayable.

A)Currently (amid much pig squeeling in the background) you can make backups with your computer but the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) using the DMCA (Digital Millenium Copright Act) are working furiously to plug that hole with DRM (Digital Rights Management) which if implemented, will cripple your computer so that you can't. Already Windows XP users computers are crippled to some degree. (Microsoft is leading the charge trying to establish themselves as the de-facto DRM "Copy Cops" ).

4) What happened to all of those old legally licensed copies you bought.

A)The dollar value of legal, legitimate, licensed music on unusable media that has ended up in dumps and landfills over the years is undoubtedly huge and probably staggering. I don't have a figure but ask yourself how many times you have had to replace a tape or a disk because it became unusable. If your young, Ask your folks how many trash cans they could fill up with LP's, 45's, 8tracks, cassettes,dvd's, VHS, betamax and cdrom's that became unusable over the years. The generally universal answer would be " A LOT"! Now multiply that times millions of homes in the US alone. Yup," A LOT" fits quite well !

Conclusion:

We have to get out of the mind set that we're buying disks or tapes. We're purchasing licenses.

The physical media the music is on is just a way of conveying it to you, the purchaser. When you purchase dowloadable music online, you never see a cdrom because it is conveyed to you the purchaser by electronic media. Even Microsoft doesn't make you buy a new license for Windows because of unusable media. They're only interested in COA's and Product Keys. The recording companies like it just fine that we buy the same licenses over and over again. They're absolute zealots at trying to stop us from making backups of the media we purchase on flimsy, unprotected, easily damaged disks but have never once offered a remedy for the reason we need to make backups. It's more than reasonable for us to expect to purchase only one license for any artist's particular work. And sellers of recording licenses should be obligated to assist us purchasers in maintaining those licenses on current, usable media - even more so if they're going to try to prevent us from making our own backups.

To end this injustice, the recording companies should change their policies and make available through their distributors:

1) Replacements for broken or unusable media for the cost of the media. If it got cracked, chipped, eaten, scatched, folded, melted, or just plain worn out, or like US currency anything over half is whole anything under half is zero.

2) Media format upgrades and updates. If it's on an LP, 45, 8track or cassette,etc, bring in the original for an upgrade to the current media format for the cost of the media.

That would be Justice !

And the recording companies would actually make money on these exchanges. Even at an exchange rate of one or two dollars they would make money because they are just replacing the media. They don't have to pay out royalties to artists. They are just repackaging a license on new, fresh media. They could even replace just the actual disk in a sleeve instead shipping the jewel boxes. It would even help stop bootleggers because people would know they wouldn't ever be able to return or exchange them when they became unusable.

Local brick and mortar recording stores could be revived from the slow death they are experiencing because it makes more sense to exchange media at a local shop (lower shipping costs) rather than having each individual packing up and shipping disks or tapes one at a time. They'd become relevent again as our backups. ( "oops! My Queen BR CD is skipping so I'm on my way to my local Recording Shop for a replacement. While I'm there, I'll have a look around for something else I might like to buy.") Is it an assault on common sense to think that getting people into your store for exchanging a broken record, could lead to the purchase of something ?

The Recording company executives have been struck stupid by their greed. In this slow economy, why don't they institute the above media exchange policy? It's the right thing to do and it's a source of income for God sake !

I personally have five or six hundred dollars worth of broken media or formats to upgrade. They might even experience a precipitous drop in their so called "rampant piracy". How much of this so called rampant piracy is simply people upgrading or replacing media on licenses they already own? Maybe just downloading the contents of one of their muddy sounding, worn out cassette tapes so they can enjoy that legally licensed music again. And who could really blame them for "Taking some digital Justice" ?

Just my humble opinion.

Zeek...

Well said... This is the only reason I ever downloaded in the first place. To replace the "damaged" media they sold me.

Great Aricle Zeek Groko !

Staying ON TOPIC
..now you KNOW when I see the word "pirates" I have to straighten that term out..
"CITE
18 USC Sec.1652 01/26/98
TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 81 - PIRACY AND PRIVATEERING
Sec. 1652. Citizens as pirates
Whoever, being a citizen of the United States, commits any murder
or robbery, or any act of hostility against the United States, or
against any citizen thereof, on the high seas, under color of any
commission from any foreign prince, or state, or on pretense of
authority from any person, is a pirate, and shall be imprisoned for
life."
Still on topic...
on TechTV tonight...they announced the
topic would be "piracy", and everyone,
knowing what a stickler I am..I wrote everyone there and sent it with a return receipt...
and got notice that for sure...
Ms. Michaela Pereira 09/17/2003 12:42:48 PM. So TechTV cannot say that they have not been informed on the proper definition of "piracy"
I'm so predictable at times
~code

There are ways to fight back against the tyranny of not only big business as it pertains to the music industry, but big business in general.

If Microsoft wants to be so quick to jump on the bandwagon and help out the RIAA, fight back. Stop using Windows. There are several other operating systems out there if you take the time to learn about them. Many are open source, meaning they are free to use. Look in to Knoppix some time.

Boycotting the RIAA doesn't have to stop with the RIAA. Boycott anyone who would take sides with them.

I agree with everything in that article except the point about a cracked or damaged CD. If it came that way new yes you should get a replacement. But if you are using the disc as a beer coaster or frizbee (or generally not caring for it in an intelligent manner, why should it be replaced for free? I dropped a few vinyl LPs in my day and yeah a few broke, but I didn't run back to the record store and demand a replacement.

Well, I have to disagree with this article. But before I start, I'm not trolling, I'm not trying to piss you all off, I'm just giving an opinion. . .

First off, we're not buying a "license", we're buying a product. And like just about anything we buy, it breaks. Usually licenses limit you to where you can use said media (ie: software licenses). Where with music we are entitled to use it anywhere it is playable, as long as we aren't making a profit from it.

Why on earth should they replace the media if it becomes unusable from "cracked, chipped, eaten, scatched, folded, melted, or just plain worn out". There is almost no other product that we purchase that comes with this extravagance, why media? If you break it, it' your own problem. Granted, most products have warranties, but the standard is 6 months to a year, not indefinitely, and definitely not from user negligence. They will only replace if it's from manufacturing defects.

Upgrading purchased media to the next upgrade is equally unreasonable. When you buy a car, they don't replace it with the next model when it comes out. Even most software doesn't include this option, you usually have to pay an upgrade fee. Almost all previous vfromats of music are still playable, with the right equipment, wich is still on the market for purchase. But then again, if your record player stops working, I suppose the company should replace it for you, free of charge. . .

Making back-up copies is completely legal, it doesn't matter how much squeeling they make, it is, and most likely always will be, legal.

DRM simply means that only YOU will be able to use the purchased media. Can still make your back-ups, but they will also contain the DRM, making it impossible to copy/convert onto another computer. We will possibly be able to make short samples for others to have, but not the complete files.

The problems that the RIAA are having is with file SHARING, not listening. If you have legally purchased (copyrighted) music, you are entitled to listen to it, but not share it.

I have been coming here for quite some time, and I constantly see people complaining about how greedy the RIAA is, yet at the same time, most of the "complainers" want free music, unlimited downloads, and won't budge one bit on their "business" models. I recently posted an article about Universal changing their prices, and over half the comments made were about how it wasn't good enough, and (i was shocked to see this. . .) that used CD's should be dropped in price also. First off, used CD stores do have a certain over-head to make. Second, a record company tries to make changes, and you refuse to. "I want my free music and movies", you say. That seems a little greedy to me.

Now, I'm not for the RIAA, I think their business model is horific (jeez, she was only 12), and have been boycotting them for years. I also don't entirely agree with alot of the people here. I love music, but aqquire it through legal means. It is simply against the law to share copyrighted music, there is no grey area here.

Changes do have to be made, but if we expect the industry to bend our way, perhaps we should bend their way a little too, and meet on a common ground.

Cheers.

I agree at this point there are so many different formats and ways to listen to music that is frustrating on the consumer end of things to be held down and restricted. We desperatly need and I do repeate need to be able to take the music and transfer it in various ways. We dont have just one way to listen in todays world we have loads. Each person has mutipul options. We have CD players in our homes, MP3 players for jogging, computer systems at work. We pay for the music we sould get to listen to it any way any how.


These people forget that they may own the copyrights on this stuff but the whole damn point is for us to buy something. To us music is a paid for good. A product. Thats why their selling it. Not for love of art just to sell and us to buy.If its not worth buying because its too fragle, has no staying power, or just plain sucks then why buy? and if we are not paying for the right to listen anytime we choose then what are we paying for?

Its been said that if there is free music on the internet why would anyone pay for it? Good question. Why? Give us a good answer and maybe people will start paying again. Its their task to find a way to make us WANT to buy. Nobody has the right to profit. You have to earn it. I work hard for what little I have. You dont get to take it from me. Give me something I can use and I will give it to you.

You guys need to go back a reread the article. Zeek does not say broken CDs, etc. should be replaced for free. It says we should be able to get a replacement for a small fee, as in the following excerpt:

"And the recording companies would actually make money on these exchanges. Even at an exchange rate of one or two dollars they would make money because they are just replacing the media. They don't have to pay out royalties to artists. They are just repackaging a license on new, fresh media. They could even replace just the actual disk in a sleeve instead shipping the jewel boxes. It would even help stop bootleggers because people would know they wouldn't ever be able to return or exchange them when they became unusable."

But lets just forget about replacing broken media for a moment and talk about songs downloaded from one of the "legal" online music sites. Should we expect a replacement of paid-for downloaded tunes if our computer crashes. Absolutely! Any software company worth it's salt will let you download paid-for software again as long as you can provide proof of purchase. This is not too unreasonable to expect.

As far as upgrading the media goes, even the MPAA recognize that expecting consumers to pay full price for something they already own is a bit much. That's why you see all of these "upgrade to DVD" rebate offers that give you some money back if you already own the movie on VHS.

Ever hear that kind of offer for a CD?

whoops, your right about the "replacement fee", sorry about that, misread part, or just plain forgot while typing. I agree with that then. My apologies.

I did reread the article. Point 2 in the third paragraph is still open to debate.

Finally an article (albeit an editorial) that acknowledges the fact that, according to the copyright licensing of music and software, you are buying the right to use the product irregardless of the medium on which it is distributed. In the vast majority of cases, this license is non-transferable meaning you can't sell the media to someone else to use (or even give it away).

I seem to remember a time when the recording industry were on the used record stores' backs because of the non-transferable license issue.

The RIAA has to make up its mind about the license issue because it looks like they want their cake (buying a license for personal use) and eat it too (make it difficult for exchange of defective media).

I know for a fact that the labels replace defective media at either no cost or the cost of shipping. Some time ago I worked for "The Wall" music (now FYE) and they touted a "lifetime guarantee" on all music/video media. Basically, all we did was open up a new cd/cassette/video without breaking the manufacturer seal, swapped the discs, and dropped the broken one in the defective box that got shipped back to the distributor. It really didn't cost the company a dime (except maybe some shipping) because it was written off as damaged/defective shipment. Strangely, I don't think they do that any more now that they're FYE.

So, what can we do? I say gather every broken cd, old cassette, 8 track, whatever, box them up according to major distributor and ship them off with tracking information along with a request for new media. After the companies get, oh say 10,000 such boxes, maybe they'll change their tunes a little.

~MAW~

Staying on topic....Good article, but I think it needs to talk more about the independent music that is flourishing on the Internet and threatened by the RIAA.

Still on topic....After all, independent artists practically act as their own labels and most are kind enough to help you out if the music you have becomes un-listenable for some reason, i.e. the CD gets broken or whatever.

Staying on topic is the goal!

DOWN with the RIAA!

:-:~ PhantomGhost ~:-:

In a perfect world...

---------------------------------------
but the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) using the DMCA (Digital Millenium Copright Act) are working furiously to plug that hole with DRM (Digital Rights Management) which if implemented, will cripple your computer so that you can't. Already Windows XP users computers are crippled to some degree.
---------------------------------------

As I said; If I you can hear it, you can copy it.

---------------------------------------
(Microsoft is leading the charge trying to establish themselves as the de-facto DRM "Copy Cops" ).
---------------------------------------

Microsoft will do anything to make a buck and will not hesitate to rip off the RIAA or anyone else in the process. Remember what happened to Apple, and other unfortunate companies like Netscape?

Interesting article that speaks what a lot of us would love to see- albeit highly an unlikely situation in the future.

What I found particularly interesting was the theory about labels replacing old formats of the same album and NOT paying licensing fees to the artists. This could, possibly, save labels money- and the only cost they would pass onto us is the cost of manufacturing and shipping. In an ideal world, of course.

With digital, physical copy-less media the future of the industry, the legal definition of license and copyright will come under increasing scrutiny and debate (and lawsuits). The RIAA should get on the bandwagon or watch their business and product atrophy to nothing. This is yet another article that shows the current industry is collapsing faster than a pier off of Cape Hatteras in hurricane Isabel.

malapropos "Granted, most products have warranties, but the standard is 6 months to a year, not indefinitely, and definitely not from user negligence." not true. there are companies that will replace the product for ANY reason. Zippo lighters will be replaced for ANY reason. as a matter of fact, there is a museum that showcases the many ways the lighters have been damaged. Craftman tools, Same.

Excellent words, Zeek!

I cannot begin to count the number of cassette tapes I have made from record albums, and even cd's. Never in a million years did I consider what I did as theft or piracy. It was my lp, my blank tape, my cd...what more do you want Cary...my blood? And the very old fm radio stations would announce in advance, the playing of an entire new album, for the express purpose of either previewing with the intent to buy, or making a copy off the radio. Dang..those were the days.

Well, as I agree to some things mentioned here, I also disagree with other things mentioned here as well. There is one thing I would like to mention, but it's off topic so I won't.

Licensing music is E V I L !
DRM is E V I L !

~goingnova

Here's a sad report on some of the people being sued by the RIAA:

http://www.downhillbattle.org/

Here's a quote that gives a glimpse of what these people are going through:

"Today I talked to a woman, my age, who is single and has two daughters. She does not have money to spare so that the major labels can make their political point and now suddenly, out of the blue, she's facing thousands of dollars in legal costs. I talked to a couple who are going through a divorce, and, as if they didn't have enough burdens already, there's the weight of a million-dollar lawsuit. Another woman who lost her job this month told an RIAA lawyer that she didn't have any money. The lawyer responded snidely, 'Well you could afford your broadband account...' Who the hell says something like that? Who are these people?"

Quite a bit of difference in broadband costs and legal costs.

For a long time I and many others have complained about the rip off of media changing and repurchasing. Of poor media quality, which results in the repurchasing also.

This will never willing float with major labels and their terrorist organization. After all, they do have their cake while they eat it at present. Something like common sense approach from our government won't float either for the same reason, people are greedy and as long as they are someone will pay them off to see what they want done.

Because payolla is wasted money when it comes to the internet radio, they wished the internet radio could be shut down. However, they had to make some kind of settlement on that. They did ensure that the money coming to them would be large for the privilage.
Mom and pop and the hobbiest is pretty well left out in the cozy deal that was made for the few.

The major labels are not after the paltry sum of a new replacement media only. They want control of the media and the music to ensure you pay top dollar.

That the cost of an album came down so quickly only indicates a few things. That they know it is over priced, even through you paid for it for years that way, without a peep heard from them. And that if business as usual can be restarted we can re-raise the price again later. There isn't and wasn't any guarrenties on the price staying there.

all i gots to say is dbpoweramp...google it

""Already Windows XP users computers are crippled to some degree. (Microsoft is leading the charge trying to establish themselves as the de-facto DRM "Copy Cops" ).""

can someone explain to me how this is so? is there something in window XP that reports what music files are on our harddrives? is there anyway to prevent that?

there really isn't anything in XP that is alarming, and all though XP does have some DRM components it does so only to stop you from copying windows itself (which many work arounds exist).

so no, windows doesn't go looking for mp3s and report back to HQ or anything. If you want to make sure you can always set up your own firewall (which is good security practice anyway).

I check frequently for Windows XP updates, but turned off the automatic feature that downloads and installs them in the background. I'm glad I did, not only because it prevented me from getting the blaster worm, but because of one that became available today. This update installs Windows [D]RM on your PC.
Ouch.

The Kid.

Who are the Pirates? Even the judges are having a hard time sorting it out.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=495&ncid=495&e=2&u=/ap/20030916/ap_en_mu/downloading_music

Court Weighs Subpoenas in Music Downloads
Tue Sep 16, 4:25 PM ET

By TED BRIDIS, AP Technology Writer

WASHINGTON - A federal appeals court panel offered few hints Tuesday whether it will permit the music industry to continue using special copyright subpoenas to track and sue computer users who download songs over the Internet.

The three-judge panel from the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia tossed tough questions at lawyers for all sides. Judges plainly wrestled with esoteric provisions of the disputed 1998 law that permits music companies and others to force Internet providers to turn over the names of suspected pirates. ...more

Also, when you install the new Media Player, the defaults are to communicate information on what you are playing back to various fuzzily described sources. I used to deselect all of these options, but finally just stopped downloading this player on new computers.

The Kid.

From Microsoft's Update site :

Additional Information
Windows Rights Management Client Privacy Statement

Microsoft is committed to protecting your privacy. This privacy statement explains data collection and use practices of the Windows Rights Management software; it does not apply to any other online or offline Microsoft sites, products or services. By using this software you are consenting to the information collection and use practices described in this privacy statement.

This software contains components that use certain Internet-based services that enable you to install and use system components of the platform necessary to enable certain features of the software, during a process called machine activation. During machine activation, your computer will be automatically connected via the Internet or by your entity’s proxy server in order to create and save on your computer a system component that is associated with your hardware. The system component is used by the software to allow you to access content that has been protected by the rights-enabled permission features of the software.

None of the information collected or generated as part of machine activation is personally identifiable. Microsoft will not retain any information collected during the activation process, except on a temporary basis where necessary to diagnose and resolve a problem with the Windows Rights Management service. Microsoft does not share any of the information collected during the activation process outside Microsoft.

Yeah or how about a CD that just NOW gets remastered, yet was issued on cd way before that in it's crappy cheap throw on CD quick type version?

And supposively the new Maiden CD has a copyright protection so you cannot rip it into mp3s, but that failed to work (at least for quite a few people!). If you pay the money for the cd, you should be able to do whatever the fuck you want with it, send the mp3s to whoever or burn copies for whoever! END OF STORY!

Come to think about legality.The inventor of the media the compact disc which the last time i checked it was JVC and/or Pioneer what would of happened if they come in and hold their hand for money how much money would left (for the riaa)?just curious

Yeah or how about a CD that just NOW gets remastered, yet was issued on cd way before that in it's crappy cheap throw on CD quick type version?

And supposively the new Maiden CD has a copyright protection so you cannot rip it into mp3s, but that failed to work (at least for quite a few people!). If you pay the money for the cd, you should be able to do whatever the fuck you want with it, send the mp3s to whoever or burn copies for whoever! END OF STORY!

Who are the Pirates?

A baseball team in Pittsburg.

I thought that everyone here would sort of enjoy this; although it will anger you at the same time. This is a paragraph from 'The Business of Media' book written by Croteau & Hoynes.
"The music industry too, has been charged with using limited competition to keep prices of cds artificially high. In 1996, the largest music companies were subject to a class action lawsuit on behalf of consumers. The suit, still pending at this writing charged that the music companies had conspired to keep prices high, despite the fact that technological advances have made cds, cheaper to produce. After a two year-investigation the FTC ruled in May 2000 that the 5 biggest music companies (Time Warner, Sony, Bertelsmann, EMI, and Universal) used illegal marketing techniques to artificially inflate prices and prevent retailers from offering discounts. The FTC estimated that consumers were overcharged by over $500 million during a four-year period.
Is this angering or what? This is what I say, "They had it coming to them." They are getting exactly what they deserved, and maybe they shoud pay us back this $500 million dollars that they scammed from our pockets. Maybe we should call it even, huh? Everyone I know agrees that they are very greedy and coniving in their tactics. I have to tell you though; because of their ridiculous prices, and half-ass selections, I haven't bought a cd in over 3 years. If everyone else would do the same, and I know that a lot of us are, we would bring them to their knees. I would very much enjoy to see a lot of these "Big Media Giants" go down. Maybe if we all started to buy independent labels they would at least have a chance. We need more alternative sources of everything. So much of what we read, and listen to is concentrated in the hands of too few greedy conglomerates. This is our time to fight back. Boycott! Boycott! Boycott! Spread the word!

Pittsburgh ends with an "H" first off. I just think this is dumb, I mean you can tape something off of tv and let a friend borrow it and watch it and as long as you are not selling it to him/her then you are not doing anything wrong. If I remember correctly our parents always taught us to share!

Sorry about t at. The " " key on my computer is not working. I will fix it in he morning.

That might have been funny had I not screwed up on the last "H". Aren't the TV copyright laws FCC? That would make them a whole 'nuther ballgame (pun intended).

In the context of music 'theft', I've always seen pirates as those who mass copy thousands of CDs and sell them for profit. Like those guys in Asia, or in the flea markets.

I never did, and still don't, see file sharers as pirates. Unfortunately, the RIAA knows that repeated and incessant use of the word will change its meaning in most people's minds if they hear it enough. We even see people using it here all the time, even though they may not realize it.

Hi everybody, Thanks for your input. I read every word. I cut the XP crippled section from the article because it was long and a bit of a sidebar. At this point it mostly has to do with moving created media to other PC's but that's just the begining of their grand plan for DRM. Check the Windows media section of Microsoft's website. For the record, It's Zeek Greko.
Zeek...

OdiOdin said:
"there really isn't anything in XP that is alarming, and all though XP does have some DRM components it does so only to stop you from copying windows itself (which many work arounds exist).

so no, windows doesn't go looking for mp3s and report back to HQ or anything. If you want to make sure you can always set up your own firewall (which is good security practice anyway)."

Maybe you should read this article:
http://www.tecchannel.com/security/client/58/
"...New product categories could also be used for more benign reasons. They make it technically very easy to open Windows Update to other software vendors. As Microsoft is trying to shift to making money with services instead of software, it might try to use the fact that most people who have Windows also have Windows Update as a lever and become the world's premier update service.

The ability of the GetSystemSpec() function of the COM component to list the software vendors of all installed software packages ( tag) is currently unused by Windows Update, but it might become a privacy issue in the future. Microsoft might be planning to open the Windows Update service to other software vendors, which could be the moment in which Windows Update starts using this feature of GetSystemSpec(). (mha "

Currently, the Win XP update catalogs a complete list of installed hardware, but also, runs a scan to report back the PID and runs a check to see if you are running a legit version of Windows, but from the above findings, it is clear that much more is in the works....