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RIAA says it's only after 'substantial' file sharers
Posted by AdvancedJon Newton in on August 18, 2003 at 9:42 PM



In an amazing coincidence, hot on the heels of senator Norm Coleman's near volte face on file sharing and subpoenas, the RIAA has now spun on its heels.

For the past several months, various music industry suitspeople have been losing no opportunity to say they'll nail anyone, big or small, who's file sharing. For example, "We’re going to sue anyone who is infringing our copyrights," said the RIAA's Amy Weiss. "We’re going to sue anybody who is file trading."

Now, in a Reuters story that's doing the rounds, the "RIAA is gathering evidence and preparing lawsuits only against individual computer users who are illegally distributing a substantial amount of copyrighted music," RIAA president Cary-Sue Sherman is quoted as saying in his 11-page 'We're basically nice guys' response to Coleman's demand for more info on the Subpoena War.

And Coleman, in turn, is being unequivocally compromising.

Reuters has the RIAA saying 'its' software locates a user's Internet address and service provider after which an RIAA employee 'manually' reviews and verifies the info before seeking a subpoena.

Unfortunately, the RIAA isn't giving out details of how its 'verification' experts do what they do, or how they do it. Thus, we can only guess at the kind of leading edge technology the RIAA is in all likelihood using.

But whatever it is, we can no doubt rest assured that those performing such sensitive and demanding tasks are highly qualified, responsible individuals.


User Comments

Intermediatesurfside6
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 9:51 PM
It's like that old joke about girls "that 16 will get you 20". I wonder what their threshold is?

The new law congress is trying to pass that will make it a felony to download 3 songs.

Oh 3 will get you 20....

Sorry about that.
DMemberJefrystube
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:21 PM
But now, he's "gratified" by assurances that the industry is initially focusing on "egregious offenders who are engaging in substantial amounts of illegal activity,"

Yeah, the magic number to be an "egregious offender" seems to be 5 files. He's "gratified"? I'm mortified. Coleman should be vilified.
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:23 PM
So do they now have the green light to shoot the ducks in the pond? I'll bet they make sure they don't get a 13 year old with a single mother, or and 70 year old, or even a GI over in Iraq. I did read an article where they said they would be selective. they have to go easy at first to establish the threshold or the foundation of the legislation they want to lobby to punish!
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:26 PM
great observation surfside!
I wonder if they expunged that poor character who had 3 or 5 songs (which were a "representative sample")?
We all know we are facing an uphill battle. The media wants to keep a lid on this, congressmen are probably milling around Cary-Sue like bumblebees in a field of flowers, with each one of them with a sneaky hand out trying to get his palm greased, and the public, although some have become interested, are still fairly apathetic. Nothing erases apathy though like getting a subpoena in the mail, and then, they will wish they did more to fight this before the DMCA passed.

I am sure though, that before Cary Sue took the subpoenas to Capital Hill, a nest of lawyers poured over which ones to have him take, as well as what their alleged criteria for filing were.
You have to remember, allegedly, the lawyers for the RIAA had already canvassed which judges would be most sympathetic to them, and which jurisdictions would be easier to win in. The lawyers also told Cary-Sue and the RIAA they need to stay away from suing poor people, or they run the risk of losing, because of public sympathy for a poor person being sued. They told them middle and upper middle income were the best. If this indeed was the case, that prior to June 26, they had already gotten information on these various jurisdictions, it looks to me as if not only the number of files being shared was in the mix, but also the socioeconomic background of the person, as well as the geographic location. The lawyers also told them that they need to win every case, and win big, not just a slap on the wrist. And out and out loss in any of the early cases would be disastrous. This means, that, regardless of what they say, they are going to select the very best cases (in their mind,using their criteria) to file. They want people that had lots of current songs in the shared folder, and from artists in their stable. They want people who are from well to do homes, and ironically, they are targetting the demographics of their biggest customers, young adults and college kids. Filing in a relatively poor jurisdiction, filing against a kid around 12 years old (and their parents), trying to get 150K per song, and having a jury of just regular, hard working folks with kids the same age as the defendant, can conceivably be the kiss of death for their case in that jurisdiction. Now, even if the RIAA loses, they can still appeal, and especially in these first cases, you can bet they will appeal as high as they can. If they begin losing fundamental cases or losing a lot of arguments in court, this could set precedent for other judges in other jurisdictions who feel uncomfortable dealing with these cases anyway, and would like an easy out (I'm not an attorney, but I know the jokes).

Ultimately, as I have been saying all along, one of our most powerful weapons is keeping our pocketbooks closed. Money is the power they wield to buy influence. In this case, it is not just the love of money, but money itself that lies at the root of their evil. To deprive them of their money is to ultimately, kill the root. We must do all the other things, but we cannot stray too far from our unified boycott. As Henry David Thoreau said:
"There are thousands hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root."

Keep the fire burning and keep hope alive!
~code
Metalwoodhead
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:39 PM
As a new member of this forum, I have posted only a few times. I find it hard to fathom that the riaa has not taken a hard look at their poster child for the napster issue. Lars (ASSHOLE) Ulrich, now here is a guy that took "his" bands intrest's and fought the down loading ( or stealing in his eyes) of "His music". Now the funny thing is that when he was fronting this (the riaa needed some one too, and I am sure they told him there would be veri little if any back lash) I am sure he didn't expect to walk out on stage at the mtv music awards shortley after and be BOO'ed and heckeled. Then when they release their next album it is a major flop, and not only because it realy s***'s, but fans as my self vowed to never buy another metallica album again. I was a Metallice fan when they went on their
tour for Kill Em All, I saw them in a small southwest town and including my self there were only twenty people in the crowd but was amazed and followed their career until the napster thing.
Before all this came around I remember ASSHOLE saying in a video and an interview that the "FANS" are the one's who put us where we are. Well the "FANS" showed ASSHOLE "WE PUT YOU WHERE YOU ARE AND WE CAN TAKE IT AWAY"
so I feel that all politicans and money hungry corp. need to take a really deep and hard look at what at one time was one of the biggest bands around and learn what happens when you turn on your fans.
Metalwoodhead
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:45 PM
oh and buy the way, I belive that it is your right as a citizen of the United States of America, when being taken to court, you can have a change of venue, by simply filling out the paper work, you may be told that you need a lawer to do so but it is YOUR RIGHT to change on you own. I know this from being arrested once for under age drinking, and filled the paper work myself. You can also have a judge removed from your case if you feel that the judge may be BIASED
DMemberOldSchoolHipHop
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:50 PM
i hope they sue me
DMemberOldSchoolHipHop
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:50 PM
i got so much to say for my defence
DMemberOldSchoolHipHop
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:51 PM
i wouldnt need a lawyer
Intermediatekneo24
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 10:52 PM
So, uh, people who share seven files are substantial sharers?

And last I checked, the RIAA didn't own any of those copyrights. They are just the voice for the record companies, who own those copyrights, unless the RIAA is saying that they are part of each of those companies, and hence that they own the copyrights since they are a part of the companies.
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:20 PM
If they select certain people using those tatics. it seems to me that would be s good descrimination counter suit!
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:22 PM
I just hope who ever they try to grill in the upcomming trials, there will be a surprize by a quick and smart attorney that blows this whole thing open!
DMemberIdontcareican
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:34 PM
Sorry I am going to repost this because I posted it late somewhere else-So if they are going around security features, does this mean they are hacking? Isn’t hacking illegal and punishable? If they RIAA has to hire someone to hack you before they get your information can you then sue them if it was security features they had to hack?
DMemberkuphd
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:46 PM
would someone please create a virus, wrap it around an mp3, let 'em download and open it, and fry these assholes' computers. wipe the hard drives. keep 'em from "collecting" their data.
DMemberwarlockamc1
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:46 PM
I know I posted this earlier in another forum, but if you're interested read TITLE 17 Chapter 5 Sec 506 of the USC. There are some legal loopholes in TITLEs 17 and 18 of the USC
DMemberIFeelFree
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:49 PM
CodeWarrior is right - a boycott is our best weapon. We're not going to win in court against the RIAA. Not with their army of high-priced lawyers and the copyright laws biased in their favor. This is going to be a long drawn-out affair. In the end the RIAA will lose, but until then how many families will be bankrupted? Sometimes the whole thing makes me sad.
DMemberIFeelFree
Date: August 18, 2003 @ 11:53 PM
Idontcareician:

They're not hacking. They're just viewing (or downloading) files that people make available on public file sharing networks. They don't even need to download the files to prove they're copyrighted material. They can use hash functions to show that the files are identical to files of copyrighted music. Of course, before going to court they'll be sure to get plenty of evidence. But they don't need to hack.
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:02 AM
I would'nt get to down hearted just yet! IFEELFREE There may just be a big suprize headed their way when they open this can of worms in the court house. I really believe Greed is being exposed in this nation. And i'll tell ya this new generation of computer wizz kids we have today will be the ones that blow them out of the water. I think this batch of no loads we have that are supposed to be our servants and representatives may find there arses out in the street! The American people are about fed up with this crap and this might turn out to the straw that will break the camels back.
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:14 AM
And don't forget we have one lawyer that is going to persue the argument that just because you have files setting in your share folder doesn't mean you are infringing remember?
Advancedpepe512000
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:15 AM
Somebody back aways suggested Code Warrior to go on Larry King....not a bad idea to get onto the Larry King show I wrote a letter..here is a copy of said letter;

Mr. King

I watch your show fairly regularly. I imagine a few people do. How would you like to have 60 million more viewers? Guaranteed! This is in reference to the fact that there is another war brewing in the USA between the population and the RIAA (Record Industry Of America) the riaa wants to start throwing people in prison for downloading music. they also want access to your personal information. Heck, they want more clout than the US Army! Do you really think it's imperative to inprison people, calling them terrorists just because they like madonna and downloaded her latest hit?

And if you think the people aren't mad, have a look at sites such as
http://www.boycott-riaa.com
www.therecordindusry.com
www.eff.org

If this isn't worth an hour of your time, I don't know what is.

I know you are generally a fair man, and would present both sides of this fight.
Just see how Americans and the world in general feel about whats happening here.

Thank you for consideration.


Lets all write Larry King. He's always looking for new material...so? May be worth a shot if everyone writes in...I say, what can we lose? pepe
Advancedpepe512000
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:37 AM
And this for all the musicians out there

http://www.musicoven.com

The Music Oven Network
email news@musicoven.com
RockgdZiemann
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:39 AM
As long as the recording industry keeps lying out of its ass, then they're still grasping at straws. Cut them off at the wallet.

Now more than ever, boycott.
DMemberuser65535
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:42 AM
Code - you know where I stand on "retaliation", heh.. but for the sake of the site, I'll just stand back and wait till it becomes obvious nothing less will serve.
I *wish* it were as simple as that, but it's likely not, tho a PAC would help.

kuphd - Riaa_Song.mp3.exe
Load it with CIH/Chernobyl and have fun out there, I am completely sure they're stupid enough to bite, since if they've got winblowz set to hide 'registered' file extensions, like most morons do, they won't even see it coming.
Unfortunately you do have to realize and accept the likelyhood of fragging innocent folk who don't know any better - what you do with this info is up to you.

What can they say.. "Oh, well, we were attempting to commit a felony and he fed us a virus!"... bah, humbug - that's like a burglar saying "Oh but I was trying to break into his house and got hurt by an illegal boobytrap!"... unfortunately in our screwed up pay-for-play court system, the "bad guys" usually win.

It seems no matter how bad our boycott puts the squeeze on em, they'll just blame filesharing more and more, since they don't live (and don't have to!) in our reality.. and no "normal" measure is going to change that.

They're absolutely terrorists, and by helping screw our economy at a time like this, borderline treasonous as well, surely they're spitting on all the principles that (in theory and when actually applied!) once made america great.

There's no penalty sufficient, in my eyes, none whatsoever, for what the RIAA has done, is doing, and will continue to do until stopped.

-user
DMemberuser65535
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:43 AM
Ignore that the website code thinks that is a link - it's not, just that the filename seems to convince the website coding that it is, sorry bout that.

-user
IntermediateSuikiogiaz
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:54 AM
I was thinking about writing to Lou Dobbs as well... he often covers non mainstream material.

I like the idea pepe, but I don't think its the right approach to start with how Larry King could drastically augment his number of viewers, no guarantee it would either. Listing the sites is a good idea though.

Getting such a large media outlet to cover this war would be wonderful, especially since it would be seen nationally. Will it work? Who knows... but wouldn't greatly assist our message if the opportunity did arise?

I'll take you up on your offer pepe. I'm going to contact Lou Dobbs with the same message. The more the merrier eh?

Suikio
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:56 AM
Wow, a day gone by with no web access and there are a TON of great posts and a few new faces. Keep it up everybody!!

We all know the RIAA uses bots to scan and (maybe, maybe not) download files, which is in direct violation of the p2p programs terms of service. I saw a post that such violations can be tried in criminal and civil court. So what the hell is taking the makers of kazaa, morpheus, limewire, bearshare, etc from suing them? My belief is they still hold faith that the RIAA will be brought to their knees and sign up for a pay-per-download thing in the future, and that lawsuits at this point won't change much. But I hope I'm wrong.

Look, to emphasize Code's point, we need to keep our wallets and purses sealed shut. Period. The RIAA has lost us as paying customers, not because of free p2p, but because of abuse of us the consumers and the artists themselves, whom the RIAA is supposed to be representing.

Please, everyone in the upcoming weeks, make it clear to those who are uneducated that this boycott has NOTHING to do with downloading free music. It has EVERYTHING to do with the abusive practices of the RIAA towards the consumer and the artists- practices which MUST be stopped.

After you write your congressmen, write the FTC and the DOJ asking for an investigation. Then write court tv and ask for any RIAA related cases to be aired live. Then write larry king or preferably bill o'reilly to get this issue out on the talk shows (I know o'reilly is for downloading music no longer available in stores).

One thing happened to me today that has an effect on people I've never seen. I was reading a printout of the USA Today story from yesterday about the recording artist's coalition in my eye doctors waiting room, when I got called in to see him. I left the article accidentally on the table. When I was ready to leave, I noticed some total stranger had picked it up and was reading it with interest. While at my parent's house for a visit I printed out another copy and left it on the coffee table just to test the theory again. Sure enough, while watching the evening news, they both picked it up off the table and read it without asking any questions as to how it got there.

BOTTOM LINE: Print out any articles you find in newspapers (linked here, of course) and leave them in public places. Doctor's offices, library tables, park benches, coffee shops, your favorite record store, anywhere where people will see it and casually read it. IT WORKS!

If the media won't communicate the issue to the public, some well placed newspaper articles scattered all over the countryside will.
IntermediateSuikiogiaz
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:02 AM
Indeed, that is a superb idea r0dr0ddy. Thats what we need innovation, to fight the stagnant threats of the RIAA.
IntermediateSuikiogiaz
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:08 AM
I plan on visiting my old high school this upcoming Wednesday, and your idea will have me carrying some extra luggage there. I had thought about posting flyers for the site, but with how obnoxiously strict my old HS likes to be, I'm not entirely sure they wouldn't be removed on immediate inspection of adminstrator. A combination of both may work the best.

Hmm... a lot of them may be under eight (obviously) which will dilute any political clout they may of had, but getting the word out is more important then that I suppose. Anyhow thats just a starting place.
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:17 AM
Cool, 15 minutes after my post and one person already has their hat in the ring. It's easy, it's fun, and it's damn effective.

To prevent yourself from being part of that "substantial files" group being sued, I just found this AWESOME search site.

For a long while I removed ALL songs which I didn't make from my p2p shared folder. Using this search engine I found that almost 33% of my legally acquired music files (yep, fair use, baby) ARE NOT PROTECTED BY THE RIAA! This means that several hundred songs on dozens of CDs I own can be shared relatively guilt free. This doesn't mean that you folks should proudly display the non-RIAA files for sharing since the individuals can still catch you, but it does allow you to breathe easier.

Bookmark this site, you'll use it a lot:
http://www.magnetbox.com/riaa/
Intermediatedirective
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:22 AM
The new ways that lawyers are showing that ppl are not "distributing" are reasons the RIAA will probably have a hard time going after these people. Lawyers are getting equipped as is the RIAA, but we'll see who wins this battle.
Advancedcaptdunsel
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:47 AM
yeah I know, I always post late but still.... I like the idea of somebody going on larry king. It would be a good way to get some exposure. Code are you up for the challenge? If not, there are others who are pretty sharp who could pull this off but it's going to take some work, (research, support etc.)I'd help anyway I can. I think it's important to get public opinion against the riaa before any of this goes to trial. They may have Lawyers, Guns and Money (sorry I couldn't resist)but in the court of public opinion they look like greedy, soul sucking, corporate fat cats trying to screw little Timmy and Suzie out of their college fund. Bad press is just as damaging as a good lawyer.
Advancedcaptdunsel
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:15 AM
I need something explained to me. I'm not real good at math so I don't understand. The riaa says they are targeting people who are downloading or uploading 600 or more files a day. I've been collecting music for 30 years. (I've got stuff on 78 speed Lp's) at 600 files a day i would have downloaded my whole collection in about 3 to 5 days. It would pretty tough for most people to come up with a dozen songs that I've never heard and yet I still couldn't find 600 songs a day to download. Even conservatively that would mean downloading 2.0 GB of data a day (not very damn likely. So I ask, where are all these egredious violators at and more importantly Where are they buying banmdwidth and where the hell do they learn about all of this music?
DMembergimpster
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:19 AM
So, when is the RIAA going to start handing out the subpoenas? Weren't they supposed to start by now?

What's taking them so long? This won't get going until people (lots of them) start getting interviewed about their horror stories.

Is the RIAA having to rethink a few things, maybe regroup a little?

Have Pac-Bell, MIT, Boston College, and Verizon's appeal put a dent in them?
DMembergimpster
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:23 AM
That's easy, capt. The RIAA is full of shit.
Advancedgoldenpi
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 3:22 AM
Theres the paperwork first, and they still need to manually sort through the thousands of potentials to remove the unsuitables (rich people, obvious mistakes, AOLers) and select the easyist targets from those that are left. The ones that will give up quickly, cant afford to fight back, and will make good headlines. Then theres a little more paperwork. It all takes time, but the RIAA should start really getting to work soon.
DMemberseraphielx
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 7:05 AM
listen up peeps

they are hacking,and i got some nice logs to prove it.

i don't download or share music or movies,but yet i am still getting hammered by ip addressess that are known offenders.

even if i do not have kazaa lite k ++ or emule running i am still getting hammered,so im getting a good list of ip addresess to block.

we are working on the pg database and will have the majority of ip addressess that are scanning computers ready some time soon.

once i am done i will post where my list is and my log so that people can see what is going on.....
Advancedcaptdunsel
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 8:33 AM
seraphielx, you're my hero, man! Glad you're on our side.
DMemberAverageConsumer
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 8:57 AM
Seraph, my router log is chock full of scans from all over the map.

Most of them looked like lovsan, but I started getting some port scans on a known gnutella port, and I'm not running any p2p progs, and I have no mp3 files on my hard drives.

I'll have to look for the next few days, but it looked like the same IP was hammering at me for over an hour last night, at port 6346.

My ISP assigns a static IP, so I bet they've been logging p2p users all along, and now they've come back to look again.

Good thing the router stealths the ports.
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:30 AM
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:32 AM
sorry... go to foxnews.com then down the page to fox life... article on teen piracy
DMembergimpster
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:37 AM
Yeah, gotta love the "tough love for pirates" angle.

To be a true pirate, don't you have to be making a profit from your activities?

My world is all secure and warm and fuzzy now that I know the RIAA loves me enough to get tough with me.

I didn't know they cared. ;-) (Wink)
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:41 AM
I hate to inform them...but I think they have already lost a good number of fans with their threats
DMemberisp-privacy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:44 AM
reading this article from fox tells me how little the media knows the other side of the story.....lets hope one of their (foxnews employees))teens are targeted for the RIAA lynch mob.
DMemberMP3Collector
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:09 AM
Here is my letter to the dear Senator:

Nice Job!! I can't believe you fell for the song and dance the RIAA fed you!! I thought that you might of been one of the sane uncorrupted senators left - but alas it appears I was WRONG!!! How could you believe what they told you??? Don't you read the papers about the RIAA subpoenas on people with as few as 5 songs being shared? Don't get me wrong I don't necessarily condone pirating music but given the stance the RIAA has taken I surely can not accept this either! You folks gave them the green light to intimidate and harass normal Americans - how can you with clear conscious side with "Big Business" as apposed to standing up for individuals?? Have you been bought too? The system the RIAA is fighting so hard to save is BROKE!!! Why should I and my fellow Americans pay to help the RIAA prosecute other Americans in a fight they will eventually lose anyway? Why do you guys up on the hill insist on letting "Big Business" run America?? Do you not hear us little people screaming for Justice and our freedoms granted us in the Constitution??? I don't believe you live up on the hill - it is apparent you live in a cave. Don't get to cozy there though because I think you ticked off a lot of people with this.

Hoffman Estates , IL
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:17 AM

Read this one:
Remove the brackets & br at the end of address and it will work

Earth Station 5 Declares War Against The Motion Picture Association of America

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/030819/lntu006_1.html
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:29 AM

Also this one

Time to give up on copyright law?

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~150~1577963,00.html
Advancedcaptdunsel
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:31 AM
I'm beginning to love the palestinians....
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:36 AM
Wow, lots of great posts and some very important topics today! Seraphielx, thank you for all the hard work you are doing, and it really helps us all for you to develop the lists.
As to the Larry King show, first off, please let me say how honored I am that so many of you have thought of me as being an appropriate spokesperson. I think that we have little chance right now of getting on LA King because he is on CNN, and due to CNN's ties to some of the big 5, I think they have gone out of their way to avoid any mention of the boycott, or even that there is a significant backlash to the actions of the RIAA. I've been on TV several times, and know a little bit about what the producers of shows look for. With the pressure on them not to allow equal voice to our side, at least, right now, I think there is little chance of us getting on Larry's show. We happen to be living in turbulent times . I just heard that a big car bomb went off in Baghdad,Iraq blowing up a refinery or something. The media is managing what peoplea are thinking about by what they report on.
I have been monitoring the letters to the leaders section of congress.org, and there are so many different issues that people are writing on, that it makes it a bit more difficult, however; we have been keeping a steady amount of letters on our issue going in, and we need to keep that up. I have written to folks not in my state or region, to some of the lesser known folks as well as the more high profile congresspeople. The lesser knowns don't get as much mail as the big names, and a brief, cordial and articulate e-mail to them, has a better chance of getting their attention. Remember, even a whisper can get attention during moments of silence.
I also wanted to underscore some excellent points by r0dr0ddy, who I must say is doing a great job of giving some direction to activities.
I agree 100 % that there is value in stressing that the boycott is not just about downloading files. Many of not most here, are not uploading or downloading any RIAA related material. This issue goes beyond filesharing, and really, goes beyond just the RIAA. The RIAA is just one organization that has taken advantage of an Act that should have never been passed in the first place! Now, there probably are schools of thought who would say that we need to focus on the RIAA and not get into other issues, for fear that this will splinter our concentration of effort. As a citizen who cherishes privacy a great deal, I believe that the RIAA issue is only the tip of the top of the iceberg. We are dealing with a government which wants to spy on us in every transaction and every communication, and even, tries to turn our neighbors and the cable installer into a cadre of snitches (the TIPS program). For once, paranoia seems like a reasonable response to the prevailing conditions.
And, I predicted some time back that this craziness would soon spread to other countries. Thus, we really are involved in an international problem. The seeds of the DMCA of course came from WIPO (World Intellectual Property Organization). Back in 1998, the EFF was fighting on our behalf to prevent the WIPO Implementation Act. http://www.eff.org/IP/WIPO/19980604_eff-aclu_bliley.letter
And, I can guarantee each and every one of you, that, left unopposed, the powers which enabled the DMCA to become a governing law over us, have far more draconian laws in the wings. There is a creeping death that is going on. It is like someone with a pair of handcuffs is standing twenty feet away, and every day is moving 6 inches closer to you and you see them coming, but feel you are powerless to do anything until finally, the lock the cuffs on your wrist. To bring this down to a school yard analogy which most of us can relate to, the RIAA and the forces of evil pushing even more evil actions toward us, are like schoolyard bullies, and anyone who has ever dealt with a bully can tell you that they pick on targets that they think are weak or marginalized. And, a curse becomes a shove, a shove becomes a hit, and so on, with them getting more bold and more aggressive. That is why more people need to wake up and oppose this before it is too late.
Now, I want to go back a second to the need for appropriate communications with the media, once we get their ears. You want to of course come off as being reasonable and likeable (which should be easy for all of us, :) (Smile) ). Also, make it clear that piracy is well defined under Title 18 of the USC and file sharing is NOT piracy. Also, there was a good question about them asking about whether anyone who settles out of court is admitting guilt. A good response is " Well, I'm not an attorney, and don't know all the facts of that case, so it would be improper for me to speculate on this." To me, one of the harder questions I asked was the one about "Don't you think that a musician should be paid for every copy of his work that is made?"
That one is very tricky to answer.
Firstly, I think the owner of a CD should be able to make a backup copy of that music CD owing to the unique vulnerability of that media to damage that renders it unplayable, and it would be unfair to make the same person buy two copies just to ensure he or she has a playable copy. Furthermore, our coalition is also concerned with the fact that the musician and songwriter, seem to get a relative trickle of the profits from their own product, so we are more concerned that the musicians are fairly compensated for their work to begin with. Notice the transition from the agenda of the interviewer to being able to restate one of our concerns?
Most of the time, when you are interviewed, they are not going to have but a couple minutes for the interview, so they are NOT going to ask the same question again.
Now to the hacking question, which I sense is getting to be more of a problem. First to averageconsumer, since you are using a router with NAT, most of the ports are stealthed, but port 113, the Ident is often not stealthed but closed. Being closed, they will "see" you. I am fairly certain the board is monitored by minions of the RIAA. I urge folks to use a proxy to visit the board. Port scanning, as has been said before, is legal, however; hacking into your computer is a violation of a subsection of title 18 of the USC criminal code. It's felony. Sending viruses out is also not a legal enterprise. For those who are getting virus emails like Hill875, please write to the abuse@theservername.com (or net) and make them aware of the activity. Sending viruses out is a violation of every TOS of every network I know of. It is not surprising that this kind of thing is happening. I do think, as Seraphielx is doing, it is good to keep a log of hacking and scanning IPs, and those who seem to be excessively pinging our machines, need to be addressed by contacting their providers. I don't like to get too organizational, but perhaps some of the more technically savvy folks like seraphielx, can work together for the best solutions. I think that seraph can be reached at seraphielx@hotmail.com (she listed that email in an earlier post). On that note, and this is just a thought here thrown out for consideration by everyone, I have noticed that there are many folks here who have special expertise in different areas, and perhaps, if those who have a particular talent in one area or another can coordinate their efforts, we may have a more effective effort. Again, just a thought. But, continuing that thought, we could think about forming various committees or groups such as:
1)Congressional correspondence-i.e. directing which members are the best to write, and drafting letters that can be used as samples for cut and paste for those whose forte may not be in letter writing.
2) Technical- as previously mentioned, keeping up with the latest technical online stuff like PeerGuardian, evaulating the best firewall software, or related matters.
3)Event producers/ independent music liason- gdZiemann and schmoo (independentm) seem to have a lot of expertise in thsi area, and probably many others do as well.
4) Media - This would include folks who have some talent for doing media related work, media releases, contacting the media about our issues, etc.
5) Legal updates - those folks who keep up to date on various laws coming down the pike, keeping us advised on the voting records.

Now, even though I made the suggestion, I have some reservations too, because all of us have regular lives and we have precious little time even to come online and post. The only reason I made this kind of suggestion was due to the fact that I noticed that there are already folks like seraphgielx, gdZiemann, et al, who are already going out of their way, giving more time and effort to this cause than they have to (and I am not ignoring Jon Newton and Bill Evans who already are acknowledged for making this board possible, and all the great posts by Jon (newjon) ). Any kind of unofficial increase in organization would be only for those people who WANT to do it that way, and only for those who have the time and inclination.
Geez, I really apologize for posting such a long post, but there were various issues I just wanted to give some input on, and I imagine, others will want to add their thoughts to as well.
Well, off to meet the Wizard, another trip down the yellow brick road!
We will win folks, it is just going to be a long, hard road. But, few things worth accomplishing come easily.
Love, luck, prosperity, and freedom to us all!
~code
DMemberMP3Collector
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:39 AM
Thanks for the link gilbd! It's always good to have news about a copyright holder who thinks copyright law is bullshit!
DMemberAverageConsumer
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 10:58 AM
gilbd, excellent link. Thanks.

Yeah, Code, port 113 is closed, but not stealthed, but it's really no biggie to me.

Let 'em look, I lead a fairly boring life, there is nothing to look at. LOL
And if they know who I am when I visit this board, so be it. I have no files or p2p progs on my drives, any of them.
When they start physically coming to our houses, it's all over, anyway.

I'm still feeling my way around the router settings, but I'll get there.

My router log is full of IPs from varous hits. Port 6346 activity only started yesterday, though. They were disappointed, I'm sure, because there's nothing to look at even if they can, not even files I legally own.

It sure seems like a big waste of resources for them to devote so much time effort, and money to this. They must be pretty sure of themselves and the ROI they'll get from this.

All the more reason to boycott music sales and downloads. Man the battlements, boys, keep yer eyes open.

Looks like it's going to be a fairly joyless existence for a lot of people before all this is said and done.

Good post, Code, as per usual.
--------------------

The question is NOT "are you paranoid?"
The question is "are you paranoid ENOUGH?"
DMemberMorphmaster
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:09 AM
Its funny how the RIAA was getting more money when napster and all these other file sharers ran. Now no one wants to buy music because they cant hear what its like before they buy the cd. Also has anyone noticed that no matter what they do to file sharing companies they dont get rid of the ability to send a file to a person on AIM or MSN instant messenger ??
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:11 AM
Look at this

BoycottBuyMusic.com
DMemberotech
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:12 AM
Free MP3 (non RIAA) downloads here

http://www.fairforshare.com/
DMemberAverageConsumer
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:19 AM
gilbd, nice link.

We're gonna make you the official linkmeister if you're not careful.

Hey, Code, wonder if it would do me any good to email the abuse people at their ISP? The scan on that port is going on 2 days now, from the same IP.

They may be sitting there, waiting for me to open a p2p. Well, it's gonna be a loooooonnnnnngggggggggg wait.

LOL
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:53 AM
AverageConsumer:
I've had people's e-mail accounts shut down in the past that were sending me viruses. The internet providers are not consistent in how seriously they take the abuse complaints. Some are very serious, others not so. But, it doesn't hurt to complain, especially if this has become a chronic problem.
I would send a copy to the ISP and mark the email HIGH PRIORITY, and if you are using outlook, use the return receipt requested tool to make sure if they opened it. If you send it return receipt, it shows if they delete your email without reading.
Give em hell bro. BTW, you can stealth that 113 port. I think you will find a big drop in scans and pings.
~code
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 11:57 AM
gilbd, great post. The line there about it not being the purpose of the site to cause BuyMusic to lose sales or customers was obviously put there to avoid a tortious business interference lawsuit. Whoever has the site did their homework in covering their legal bases. Good for them! :) (Smile)
DMemberAverageConsumer
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:07 PM
I hear ya, Code, I'm learning fast.

I can put tons of hardware together in my sleep, but I'm still a newbie in terms of networking.

Learning all the time, but one thing is consistent:

Everyone: stop using RIAA products! No buy, no download. They want to step it up on port scans, I say we step it up on the boycott.
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:22 PM

Thanks AverageConsumer but if they get to be too much just let me know. I just trying to help here. Thanks again. Now look at this one

Time to give up on copyright law?

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36%257E150%257E1577963,00.html
DMemberAverageConsumer
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:25 PM
gilbd, post away, I wouldn't see any of those if you didn't put them up for us.

Code, port 113 is fully stealthed now. I wonder how much trouble I'd get into if I used the offender's IP for my internet proxy?

LMAO
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 12:57 PM
lol... :) (Smile)
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:14 PM

Not sure about this Maybe some of you know about it. Can explain it. Like CodeWarrior - AverageConsumer or IFeelFree. I'm not that smart when it comes to computers.

Is There Any Such Thing As A Good Worm? (Wagner's Weblog)

http://www.internetweek.com/security02/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=13100545
DMembergilbd
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 1:18 PM

I read somewhere that the RIAA is using a Yellow Worm. But I lost it before I could post it.
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:13 PM
As much as I know about computers, I'm fairly new to the world of full time internet connections and networking. So I have a few questions for those of you "in the know":
1) Port scanning seems useless. They can't hack into your PC and view your files unless you use a p2p program that allows others to see your shared folder. What's the point of port scanning?
2) How the hell can posters on this website get tracked by the RIAA et al? IP addresses are not logged on this site. Perhaps only the webmaster has access to the IP address of users and posters.
3) Don't routers have hardware firewalls that prevent any incoming requests from any source (unless you allow certain ports through)?
4) Closed, stealthed, open, etc, what the hell do those terms mean?
5) Why is port scanning not compared to hacking? Isn't port scanning a precursor to hacking?

Thanks to anybody who can help clue me (and others!) in.
IntermediateSuikiogiaz
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:18 PM
code, I agree you would make the best spokesman.

I'm aware it is improbable that someone like Larry King or Lou Dobbs would actually take a single email into consideration. Perhaps if I write one initial email explaining the situation, our reasons for opposition, ect... and then follow up every 2 weeks approximately with a laconic synopsis of our reasons, and then an update on the current events that have transpired since my last email.

I'm sure AOL Time Warner wouldn't be thrilled about such a report, but perhaps persistence will give it an opportunity.

As for your idea of developing committes within our ranks, I think that would be a stellar idea. I follow politics considerably, and my writing skills are decent. Perhaps I could assist in the congressional correspondent area.

Tomorrow when I go to visit my old HS I was planning on meeting with my AP Gov teacher. I think he could help me discern which congressional members may be the wiser choices of recipients of our letters.
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:24 PM
Here's some answers rodroddy:
1) Port scanning seems useless. They can't hack into your PC and view your files unless you use a p2p program that allows others to see your shared folder. What's the point of port scanning?
Think of ports as doors. They knock on all the doors on your computer looking for one to establish a connection with, i.e. to enter through. Once they get in through a port, they can upload a trojan horse back door program that can let them come back and have full access to your box.
2) How the hell can posters on this website get tracked by the RIAA et al? IP addresses are not logged on this site. Perhaps only the webmaster has access to the IP address of users and posters.
They can scan the port people you to connect to that board and get the IPs of everyone who is connected, and unless you are using a proxy, have your internet identity (esp. if you have a static IP)
3) Don't routers have hardware firewalls that prevent any incoming requests from any source (unless you allow certain ports through)?
Most hardware routers do offer a lot of protection by putting your machine behind a NAT (network address translation) which helps to hide the computers from direct access by outside computers.
5) Why is port scanning not compared to hacking? Isn't port scanning a precursor to hacking? Here's a perfect example of why port scanning is not illegal and is not hacking. Let's say you have a house with a 100 doors. The house is not "stealthed" so anyone can see it. A guy walks up to each door and knocks on it,and then tries to turn the handle and open the door. He knocks on each door and says "Anybody home?" You hear him,but have the door locked and don't answer. This is like a closed port. He hasn't come into your house, so no breaking and entering, and hasn't stolen anything nor disrupted your house. Now, if he finally finds and open door, comes in and starts living in there, rearranging the furniture, reading your mail, and eating your food, that is a crime.

Now, let's say you stealth your system like AverageConsumer did. Now, he cannot even see your house for sure. He can walk up where he thinks a house may be and randomly knock and say "Is anyone home?" but now, he can't even find a locked door to say for sure there is or isn't a house there.

~code
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 2:41 PM
btw...i was on a discussion board which exposed a certain group. one of the posters was against us, and was there over a few weeks, posting and responding to posts. Finally he revealed that he was a hacker that was sent to get the IP addresses of everyone on the board. The board admin, then gave out this cat's IP address. I thought he was full of beans, but did a log search for that IP and damned if he didn't try scanning my IP, but I was fully stealthed, so he could GUESS that there was someone there, but he never could be sure, because he didn't even find a closed door. So, I know they can do it, and I think it is through scanning either the port you connect to the board through, or through the IP of the board. I'm a bit unsure on the specifics, but rest assured,they can do it. that is why you will see i have been advocating always coming here through a proxy. i used to say that i am never where i am...i use proxies from the USA, europe, and the orient, and change from time to time, so any IP they get, is suspect.
~code
DMemberIMissedIt
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 4:10 PM
I've also been hammered for days now. Gnutella port address.

I have never had any p2p file sharing software on my machine.

Grasping at straws?
DMemberRingdemBells
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 4:38 PM
Personally I haven't bought a CD in over 6 months (conscious decision), and have educated my wife as to the wily ways of the RIAA, so she's bought hardly any CD's this year. We both love music and have given untold $thousands to the Record Companies, but not anymore, not at least until they stop criminalizing file sharers.

From now on, if I'm interested in a CD I'm going to research it first to see if that recording company is associated with the blood suckers.

One thing concerns me about file sharers out there, if/when this blows over, hopefully people will start sharing again (apparently some have only been takers and never givers). Put the "share" back in file sharing in other words or else P2P will be worthless.
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 4:39 PM
Thanks for the straight answers, code. In a knee-jerk reaction I went and installed peer guardian. Sure enough, within 5 minutes of installing, some jerk at universal studios pinged my IP. But that's the end of it, PG soon crashed and I can't get it to work again, despite reinstalling it. Oh well. I'm not sharing any RIAA/MPAA material anyways.

OK, so I have my router set to only allow one open port, that for my gnutella client. I understand there are thousands of ports available on any given IP. Wouldn't the RIAA have to scan each and every port on the router in order to find the one I have set open? And once they found it, what the hell could they do with it? I seriously doubt they'd upload a trojan horse...

And isn't there anything that can be done to block port scanning on this website? Shouldn't there be a host of web developers' tools to prevent that sort of stuff?
DMemberHill875
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 4:45 PM
I think was the RIAA meant to say is that "We are currently going after those with substancial cash, instead of substancial loaders"
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 6:01 PM
Rodroddy, there are progz out there that scan for open ports at a very fast rate. They can take an IP block of addresses, and just let the program do the work pinging for a response. I doubt the RIAA would try to upload a trojan (but I wouldn't put much past the toadies they hire). And there are lots of people from around the world looking for open ports in a storm (pardon my metaphor). I only advise people to do ALL they can to protect their individual rights of privacy, constitutional rights, etc., and believe this is what being a true American means (the price of freedom is eternal vigiliance). There really is only so much you can do, kind of like protecting your car with alarms and the club and all. You can buy a router and get your machine behind that (quite a few states have tried passing laws that would make this illegal), get one or more good firewalls and put all the evil meanie addresses in, stealth all ports, even 113, keep a good antivirus updated with the latest signatures, use good software firewalls (just checked the Primedius free version, it's ok, but the free version has limited functionality) and keep them up, check your logs to see who is trying to break in, and use proxies whenever possible. Setting up chain proxies is a good notion, but hard to keep updated. And sad to say, but P2P is something I am going to lay off of for a while.
But Rod, all this makes me mad/angry. Why should we have to be like little spinsters behind a dozen locked doors, looking out at the world through a tiny peephole. We are the goodguys!
I think that a lot of my angst and anger comes from that. The good guys, all across this country are getting the shaft. Our brave soldiers are getting cut down in their prime in foreign lands. It's kinda sad that it seems at times we come down to our only weapon being that we are not going to open our pocketbooks wide enough to let the bastards just reach in and grab it all. I am losing faith that our votes really mean much. I mean, the guy who got the most votes in the last election LOST! What kind of bizarro world has this become.
When I see how such injustices go on in this country, and so many people seem so slow to awaken, even when it is in their own interest to wake up and act, it can get disheartened. In my previous intervention into a government sponsored bill (which an organization I started defeated in house and senate), I got so disheartened at the apathy of folks and how hard it was to get them to write a letter (in the days before email). One thing I have seen in this fight, is the people here ARE more motivated, and do seem to "get it" that this is not just about file downloading , but about our rights to be left alone, to have privacy, and to live our lives without being under the thumb of big brother. I am so proud to know people like you, and EVERY person here! Sometimes, we can only bitch and moan, but at least, it indicates we know that things are not right and must change, and every real revolution came about from just those humble beginnings.
Everyone here, day by day, is fighting for a cause, and that cause, is right. We may each be Davids, and the powers we fight may be Goliath size in proportion, but we have the stone of righteousness, and the sling of technology. And, Goliath is just tall, that's all, and when he falls, he has a long way down.
Every letter we send out,every rally held, every flyer that goes out, is another straw in the fire of freedom. May freedom burn brightly again in this land, and may we each, someday again, be able to bask in its reflected light, while the toadies and rats in the RIAA, must scurry away into eternal darkness.
Sorry for the long diatribe, but as always, I hope you all are patient with the ramblings of the CodeWarrior.
The post is really saying how proud I am of each one of you, and that your dedication and energy should give cause to everyone in the USA to see that the spirit of the founding fathers is not deal, but lives with every glowing phosphor on the screens of these monitors, and in every keystroke.
OK, that's the speech :) (Smile)!
peace and victory!
~code
AdminCodeWarrior
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 6:02 PM
:) (Smile) meant not dead, not "not deal"..maybe I'm getting DySlExIc from typing too much :) (Smile)
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 7:20 PM
Code, what you consider "ramblings" I consider speeches that deserve to be printed in "famous speeches of the 21st century" years from now. Kudos to you, my friend.

Grrr, in a news story on my local CBS (viacom) affiliate, they mislabeled the story as "college students who download music off the internet may face expulsion". It should read: "College Students Under Attack". Read on, and decide for yourself if this story has any spin:

Marc Cox, News 4


St. Louis (KMOV) -- Millions of college students will soon be heading back to campus and in their spare time many of those students will download music files illegally.

Now, music producers are cracking down on college campuses. Students and parents need to take this issue seriously.


Many students face a new test when they get to campus this year, memorizing the school's internet policy. At the University of Missouri St. Louis they are going one step further.


“We're going to ask the students to sign a copy before we'll turn their Internet connection on,” says Dr. Jerry Siegel, the Vice Chancellor at UMSL.


The problem, too many students are illegally downloading music and the music industry is on the warpath tracing those downloads to the door of the university's computer nerve center.


Security analyst Tom Kyle investigated three to four cases each week last semester. He says high speed Internet access on campus makes it tempting for students.


“You can use these peer to peer file applications, you can use them legitimately, but by and large the majority of people are using it to violate copyright law,” says Kyle.


That is the problem facing schools like UMSL. File swapping is nearly impossible to stop ahead of time. Adding to the problem, college students fit the age group most likely to download, and many students see music downloading as a victimless crime. For the artists, it's starting to cost them a fortune.


“It’s becoming a big deal, because record sales are down,” says Clayton attorney Jeff Michelman. He knows that because he represents some major artists, including St. Louis native and hip-hop star Nelly.


Michelman says hip-hop and alternative artists are being hit hardest, in part because their fans are more Internet savvy.


“That's how you get compensated in this business. If they're not compensated because there's piracy instead of purchase, they're going to lose a lot of money,” he says.


On campus, the threat of lawsuits is catching the attention of at least some students.


“I know people who download a lot of MP3's on their computer but they've stopped because of all the lawsuits and people being sued,” says Mary Beth Barton.


At UMSL, those who don't follow the rules face probation and possible suspension regardless of the excuse.


Call it a music lesson that is no longer an elective.


Because most universities provide Internet access for their students, they are bound by the "Digital Millennium Copyright Act." Click here to read the act.


If the schools don't shut down the illegal use by students quickly enough, they might also face prosecution.
DMemberr0dr0ddy
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 7:22 PM
Oh yeah, and linked to the article there's a poll, asking about downloading music off the web and the RIAA's reaction:
Of 400 votes thus far:
22% say "It's stealing, it's wrong"
18% say "Downloading a few songs isn't so bad"
60% say "Music industry is overreacting"

Hmmm... where do you think public opinion is on this one?
DMemberHill875
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 7:56 PM
The recording industry and those turds that profess to be the headmasters of colleges and universities, are living in a fantasy land. I hate to bring this up, but I don't like talking about the Ruskies. If anyone remembers why the French Revolution took place, it was because the aristocrats and the royals were out of touch. Some (the royals) used to comment, why the people are complaining? They have a roof over their heads, something to eat,etc. What they didn't see or cared to know is that the people were tired of being poor, hungry, abused and rated as second or third class citizens. Do you think the rats at RIAA and the head honchos at the colleges and universities know much money people really make just to make it? Why do you think there are so many bankruptcies? Is because people does not make enough money to have the things that we all take for granted. Now how do they (the RIAA)propose to collect $150,000 per song? Well let me use my fuzzy math to get the results, or maybe I'll use the RIAA's calculator and have one of their accountants double check my math.
DMemberseraphielx
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 8:14 PM
ok guys time to goto the master to see if your shit is stealthed http://www.grc.com look for shields up

hey why didn't i think about getting steve gibson in on this kill taker???
DMemberchurchkey
Date: August 19, 2003 @ 9:42 PM
The place to go on is the O'Reilly Factor on Fox. Their format is debate with a person from the opposing view...aka cary sue...wouldn't that be wild? Code and carysue? Seriously folks...Fox would do it...they have already had several segments devoted to file sharing. Or, a member of congress could represent the governments issues, and wow...I think it would be a great way to get the message out far and wide. We can e-mail Fox and start the ball rolling...just give the word.
DMemberBadGuin
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 12:35 AM
ok, seraphielx, AverageConsumer, CodeWarrior...... I need help

I did the sheilds up thing Sera mentioned above and I've got ports open and only one is stealthed, the rest are there but closed. I'm running peerguardian and zonealarm but I want to be invisible.

email me @ Ladyguinmopar@hotmail.com

THANKS!
DMemberaprilhouse
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 12:44 AM
Just get http://www.primedius.com/ and your IP is blocked by their servers. Nobody can see what you are doing not even your ISP.
DMemberron77
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 1:15 AM
Okay how about this we need everyone in the states to get back on sharing one song, set up a clearing site so different people are sharing different songs. Say 10 people per song thats 6 million songs if 60 million do it.

R
DMemberWulfhound
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 5:08 AM
just a note aprilhouse. using a proxy is not fool proof. if someone uses a proxy in a malicious manor and pisses off the wrong person, a copy of the remote i.p. address is still kept on logs by the public server and a court order could force them to give it up.
although, for the casual user, it's still better than nothing.
DMemberWulfhound
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 5:30 AM
well, i feel vindicated.
after reading this post: the anatomy of file download spyware
http://grc.com/downloaders.htm
several months ago while browsing CDNOW's site, i clicked on a link to listen to a sample of music which required real player to stream.
although i loath real player and all the garbage that comes with it i did install the most basic version allowed. i downloaded the file and locked down my system to be cautious.. and sure enough, the player would not run, it REFUSED to run unless i gave it net access. within 2 minutes that crap was off my system and i scoured my registry to make sure it was off for good.
i sent CDNOW a scathing letter as to why they would endorse a program that was obviously running spyware. i also said i would not be back to spend any money until they offered an alternative streaming format such as Windows Media Player. BTW, they now offer both.
stop spending $ and they listen?
DMemberJohn316
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 11:28 AM
To whom ever can HELP:

I ran Shields Up and have two ports open , and would like to know how to close them. I have a firewall and I need to know how to close these two malicious ports.

Thanks
IntermediateSinisterX
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 3:14 PM
Interesting but, I don't believe a word of it. I always take what the RIAA says with a grain of salt. I no longer share anyway as I am boycotting the entire industry and refuse to support them by downloading and or burning any of their shit music and that goes for movies as well.

IntermediateNiceGuy2003
Date: August 20, 2003 @ 10:17 PM
Well, according to my dictionary, one definition for "substantial" is strong; solid; firm. So in reality, just sharing 1 single song is "substantial" evidence for the RIAA that you're violating copyright.
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