BMG Germany's Dr Martin Schäfer and Fraunhofer Group's professor Karl-Heinz Brandenburg have fascinating insights on how the music industry can handle file sharing, and at the same time turn 'Kazaa's Kids' into good, paying customers.

In an August 18 story called Capturing Kazaa's Kids as Customers, "To kill two birds with one stone [... severely dent the power of the pirates and return the industry to profitability ...] the record labels must embrace the generation that threatens them and give it what it wants," says Germany's Deutsche Welle.

"Instead of a prolonged and ultimately losing war, the music industry must face up to the fact that it's more a case of 'if you can't beat them, join them - but make them pay for it'."

So how do you make them join? And how do you make them pay?

Quoted in the Deutsche Welle items, Schäfer says, "Providers such as AOL and T-Online should co-operate with only trustworthy partners and not allow their services to be hijacked by the pirates. By blocking certain addresses and preventing users from reaching these sites, we could provide a virtual shopping mall where only legal sharing takes place."

He went on, "The Internet will remain unaffected. It would just be a contract between two businesses - the Internet provider and the legal sharing portal. This would create a security wall within the Internet. Why should a company want their product out there in the illegal domain? An agreement between trustworthy partners would force those who want illegal music to change Internet providers, someone less reputable ... they aren't going to do that."

'Legal sharing portal,' huh?

Brandenburg, "a pioneer in MP3 technology with the Fraunhofer Group for Electronic and Media Technology," thinks the Internet itself, 'must be controlled as one part of the on-going struggle and that, in principle, improved legal services would tempt users away from bootlegging but believes that the ethical questions must also be addressed.

"We are dealing with a generation of kids with no conscience," he apparently said, kids, "who don’t believe they are doing anything wrong. There is a huge question of legality here. There should be clear definitions about what is unacceptable and it should be clear to people that if they do these things, they will be punished."

He adds that improved security and service could combine to, "move the industry closer to controlling Internet piracy and closer to turning Kazaa’s kids into customers".

Why am I not surprised?

Hmm, DRM and Palladium by any other name...................

"ACTUNG" YES SHULTZ PUT THEM IN STALAG 13 YAH YAH DR. Strangelove!

So hooking up the labels with kazaa is the end to there worries? Give me a break! Even if that happens, PPL WILL STILL GET MUSIC FOR FREE. A lot of ppl will see the pay version and then go, i want the free version and go get that one.

fukin NAZI

the only right thing he said is that the music industry is fighting a "losing war"

PEOPLE! Our best shot is a HUGE WAVE of Americans to shift the tide of these bought out leaders in congress and lying /cheating money hungry business creeps. KEEP focused on 1. BOYCOTT and 2.GET ORGANIZED the rest will fall in as they start the lynch mob proceedings

What they are proposing is simpley forveing broadband ISPs to install p2p-blockers to stop people using p2p, thus forceing people to use only legitimate sites. If this approach happens to stop people runing their own servers, kill the personal web page, disrupt IRC systems and block VPNs, well, the pirates will be stoped so why should the RIAA care?

While AOL might just consider talking about this plan if heavily pressured by its time-warner half, no other ISP would consider it for a moment. P2P is the main reason anyone buys broadband connections, and those ISPs know it. Schafer says blocking systems like that would force people wanting illegal files to move to less reputable ISPs. Correct. He also says people would not do that. Incorrect. Look whats happened to ISPs attempts to throttle p2p so far. The customers just wont tolerate it.

STUPID FUCKING IDIOTS!!! So, they "like" p2p as long as they can HIJACK and OBTAIN $$$ from all the users of p2p? (Guess what folks, that was the plan they had all along!)

But guess what!

The INTERNET itself provided ALL people who have access to have a SAY in things!
THEY are trying to TAKE the Internet away from us and regurgitate it back at us as a "new fangled" TV/Radio/etc.

Tell them to GET A FUCKING CLUE!

The Internet BELONGS to the PEOPLE and even MORE SO than the "airwaves" and "broadcast" ever did and a THOUSAND times more so. (WHY? --because you are reading my words...and because YOU can say words that people can access TOO!)

The FOUNDING FATHERS of the USA got it RIGHT with the FIRST AMENDMENT!

(FIRST usually means MOST IMPORTANT!)

STOP THE RIAA!

REPEAL DMCA!

GO TO IOWA! (sorta rhymes spelling-wise)

Support Local and Independent Music!
(e-mail me for my band's CD!)

Don't boycott the French... BOYCOTT THE RIAA! (Well, I take that back, Vivendi is a French Company after all!)

I would'nt put much weight on this article its a lot of smoke blown from Heinz struddle doomkaulf looking for some media attention!

"By blocking certain addresses and preventing users from reaching..." and "The Internet will remain unaffected." out of the same mouth? What a hoot.
No, imho, it is him that 'must be controlled'!

You know a funny thing happened to me yesterday, I went to a free local concert and one of the bands playing gave out their CD for free. Yes FREE and at a free concert none the less. If only the RIAA could control bands giving out there CD's for free...somebody better call the lawyers!

Superninerfan

It is easy to see who has interest when you look at the tone of the message. Somehow, it leaves fingerprints all over the message.

Let me bring up a little item here from personal experience. It is the rare site on the internet that has a product for sale that doesn't want to have a credit card to do business.

Newsflash!!! I don't own credit cards. I have a problem with the way they charge for their services. It, like the products coming out of Hollywood are outrageous and my dollar is a vote for what i believe in.

On the otherhand, when Audiogalaxy was up and running you could pay by electronic check. They made it easy to pay. So guess what? I paid. I had no problem with that. It was my choice.

No isp is going to promote blocking of ports for regular users. If they do, it is one business I will not do business with. Don't think they don't know that?

Good luck to the RIAA and the MPAA, reminds me of a dog chasing its tail and just can't get ahead to hear the speel.

This Schafer guy is a major league assh0le. He's also living on another planet. Blocking IP addresses would "force those who want illegal music to change Internet providers, someone less reputable ... they aren't going to do that." What??? File sharers would desert these ISPs faster than rats from a sinking ship. Also, there would be a serious backlash from non-file sharing customers over having IP addresses blocked. Too many people want to control the internet. You can't do that without desroying it. People do not want their choices dictated by corporations. The strength of the internet (as opposed to TV and radio) is in its anarchy. Take that away and it's lame.

(FIRST usually means MOST IMPORTANT!)

STOP THE RIAA!

REPEAL DMCA!

"GO TO IOWA! "(sorta rhymes spelling-wise)
Help me out, friends - I live in Iowa and have been unable to find what I have missed regarding "Iowa". Have been looking and don't see a reference, but something good must have happened. Thanks

if they would be smart and made a news server thing where you could just connect to one central server, and get anything, apon everything you could ever download, for a small fee of 5-10$ a month, you would have millions of peeps using that... it'd really cut down piracy alot, and on top of that, screw the riaa over in a way.... yet be perfectly legal.

I found great humor in his hitler like thinking that the internet must be controlled! Not only is this guy an AHOLE but a political monkey heh shake another dollar in the air he might quote himself... I clipped out an article in our local paper back on April 23 and saved it because it had the most amusing story and headline quoted as saying "It's been very difficult because students have grown up viewing the Internet as a place where you go to get lots of free access to things" Found in the Kansas City Star.

I just thought to let everyone know, that some A/O is trying to send me a Subseven-Trojan. It has happened before when I went to the Congress.Org site and almost everytime I come here. Luckly for me I have a firewall and virus protector installed in my box. I also have PeerGuardian. In case someone wants to know this is the IP of the A/O that tried to send me the Subseven Trojan; IP 141.150.139.182 New York. I hope we are not being targeted by the A/O at RIAA.

If the A/O 14.150.139.182 is lurking around this site I got news for you. I will write to your net provider and let them know what the f you are doing. So stop it. Go play with you s.. someplace else.

141.150.139.182 comes back to Verizon DSL. If they sent an e-mail, you can forward it to abuse@verizon.net and demand they deal with this abuse of their service.
-bulk

141.150.139.182 comes back to Verizon DSL. If they sent an e-mail, you can forward it to abuse@verizon.net and demand they deal with this abuse of their service.
It's doubtful it was from 14.150.139.182,
cause that's registered to:
OrgName: Internet Assigned Numbers Authority
OrgID: IANA
Address: 4676 Admiralty Way, Suite 330
City: Marina del Rey
StateProv: CA
PostalCode: 90292-6695
Country: US

NetRange: 14.0.0.0 - 14.255.255.255
CIDR: 14.0.0.0/8
NetName: PDN
NetHandle: NET-14-0-0-0-1
Parent:
NetType: IANA Special Use
Comment: Please see RFC 3330 for additional information.
RegDate:
Updated: 2002-10-14

OrgTechHandle: IANA-ARIN
OrgTechName: Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Number
OrgTechPhone: +1-310-823-9358
OrgTechEmail: res-ip@iana.org

-bulk

Thanks bulk. I have their efin info. My firewall gives me info. I just what to see the pattern and fire my salvo.

Am I the only one getting this kind of abuse here?

Hill,
I'm sure they are targeting more ppl than just you. My computer at home used to get hacked at least 5 times a week if not more, until I got my computer nerd friends involved and they hooked me up with some special software. That only lasted until someone managed to bypass everything I had setup and crashed my computer with a very vicious virus that destroyed my hard drive. But here at work I'm protected by gov't firewalls and proxy's and all that other good stuff. Hopefully whoever it is will get tired and give up.

rangeflower...
I don't believe anything has happened in IOWA. I, too, live in Iowa and have been following this board and current events and nothing has happened in Iowa. This, of course, is old news to everybody else.

I used to get Subseven trojan warnings several times a day. Then I got a Cable/DSL router, and I haven't gotten a single intrusion warning since. Someone told me that they are the "Ultimate Firewall", something about the hardware providing a wall that can't be bypassed, or something...

I just started checking my router logs a few days ago, and it opened my eyes.

I am amazed at the number of hits I get each day, especially with the lovsan virus going around. Port 135 is taking a real beating, good thing the router stealths all the ports.

I have all ports forwarded to my laptop. Disabled the windows file shareing module and stoped the RPC service. That stops most viruses.

Guys Take a look at this, more especially take a look at the 12 year old opinions, If this isn't clever marketing by the RIAA to come up with thoughts by 'teenagers' i don't know what is! As if these teens think like this. RIAA if your listening, you need to learn the word 'subtle' there's no way teenagers that age those words....seriously! Everyone goto:

http://www.inboxrobot.com/news.php3?fid=26247477

Don't get me wrong, but if the RIAA didn't sue innocent technology specialists (the College 4,) I wouldn't be here, whether or not they had 'shut down p2p" I just never would have been aware of it.

The problem, of course, is that the RIAA is doing everything possible to piss me off.

Truthfully, if they put out an online service at a REASONABLE price, but which had the SELECTION of a p2p network, then I'd have gone there.

What people like the author of this article fail to realize is that p2p is superior to what the labels have to offer, because the labels intentionally cripple their products by A) DRM, which makes it inconvineient to use, B) only putting a VERY limited selection out into the marketplace.

The fact that p2p is free, rather than pay-for, isn't the real reason I miss p2p (yes, I pretty much gave it up, and I STILL don't buy RIAA records) The reason is that p2p has always had had a much better selection, because the people got to choose what was offered. It took control of distribution out of the hands of the moguls and into the hands of the people - all we wanted was CONTENT. And we didn't get it.

"Kazaa Kids" are savvy - they know that even with file spoofing, the selection on p2p networks DWARFS anything put out by any of the 5 labels. Hell, it dwarfs pretty much any record store - any warehouse, because those are limited to copies which are currently in print.

There's a possibility here to make more money by delivering a product that people want, and they refuse to do it, because delivering what the customer wants means that the record label loses control over dictating WHAT the customer wants.

wet1 has a point. If what this Schafer guy says ever came to be, then the chances are high they would REQUIRE a credit card. The reasons are simple. With a credit card, the labels could insert hidden charges without your knowing. Sure, some credit cards provide that, but those are usually the Platinum cards that you have to make $100,000 a year to have. Most people have those unsecure, pre-approved cards, though, which makes it harder to stop unauthorized charges.

Now, if they did offer to pay by check, I'd run out and set up a checking account to do that. But they won't and here's another reason. With a monthly check, which requires a monthly bill to be sent out, YOU have the choice of whether or not you want to continue using a service. You can say no by not sending in a check. But with a credit card, you actually have to contact the service and request your account to be terminated. That's not going to please the RIAA so they'll tell their people to cajole you into a free month or two, but in reality they'll charge you anyway.

Yes, I know of sites and ISPs that'll automatically take the money out of your account every month. Like AOL. And then when you want to cancel your account, they to cajole you into a free month. Please spare me. My mother had a good ISP that was well within her budget, but then they started blocking a gaming site she had been going to. Why, we don't know. And they would through you off exactly every four hours so she finally found another ISP. Well, the first ISP offered her a free month, even after she expressed her dissatisfaction with the service, but she refused.

So anyway, you see what's happening here. They want ISPs to block sites they deem illegal, like file-sharing, warez, p2p, porn and anything else. So eventually they'd find a problem with fans having sites dedicated to their favorite band/singer or favorite sports team and have them banned. Then they'd have sites like this banned, saying they were a danger to the nation. Where would it end? It's about complete control.

It's like when Gutenberg invented the printing press. Monarchs and even the Catholic Church pitched a fit. Now people could have easy, cheap access to the written word. In the case of the Church, it meant the average person could have a copy of the Bible and that just wasn't going to be tolerated. So they began to take over the presses, trying their best to control what was printed and who was given access to what was printed. It got so bad that when John Adams sat down to write the Bill of Rights, he had to insert a clause allowing freedom of said presses. That's why our country has enjoyed a greater freedom of the press for longer than most other nations.

Perhaps the time is nigh that we petition Congress for an amendment guaranteeing freedom of the "digital" press. A guarantee that no law can be passed or interpreted to shut down a someone's website/service. We can't allow history to repeat itself. It took 300 years for freedom of the press to be guaranteed. Do we have to wait 300 years for freedom of the digital press to be guaranteed?

"...force those who want illegal music to change Internet providers, someone less reputable ... they aren't going to do that."

Less reputable than AOL? These people are on crack.

I'm so sick of hearing these idiots offering a pay to download service as some kind of panacea. I won't pay 79 cents for an MP3...I won't pay 1 cent for an MP3...dammit! The point of P2P is that you can download the stuff for FREE, and get rid of it if it sucks or if it's not what you want.

As far as copyright laws they're simply riduculous. I've seen photos of people like Napoleon and Charles Darwin that magically have a copyright tagged on them for Chrissakes (pictures of him, too, probably). People are just "copyright happy".

If you follow the proponents of modern copyright logic that artists will only creat if assured monetary compensation, then I guess that means that the cavemen in prehistoric France must have had copyright laws now lost to history.

ROFL!

this is a small excerpt from : http://www.insightmag.com/news/450405.html

"..an RIAA-supported bill in the House that would make copying even one copyrighted song on a peer-to-peer network a felony with a maximum sentence of five years in prison."

Hey everyone! all 60 million of us will get a free stay in a government run hotel, 3 hot meals a day, cable tv, weight room, library and a host of other amenities if they pass that one!
Hell, the way I see it, ppl 'on the inside' have it easier and have more rights that we do 'on the outside'. What the hell, if they're willing to pay to give me a 5 yr vacation from life.... I'll start downloading the hell outta their music. Wonder if they'll give us 5 yrs for each song? We could live in the lap of luxury the rest of our natural born lives and our offspring for the rest of this millinium.

Get REAL!

p.s. I loved that single finger salute, I cant find it to give credit, sorry

A felony for downloading ONE song? That's so insane I can't even imagine it.

Yes, it is definitely time to vote those crackheads out of office.