The Senate Governmental Affairs' Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations has apparently received the information it demanded from the RIAA.

Last month subcommittee chairman senator Norm Coleman gave RIAA president Cary-Sue Sherman two weeks to produce:

Copies of all subpoenas issued to Internet Service Providers (ISP) requesting information about subscribers;

A description of the standard the RIAA is using when filing an application for a subpoena against an ISP with a US District Court;

A description of the methodology it's using to secure evidence of potentially illegal file sharing by computer users;

A description of the privacy safeguards the RIAA uses when securing this information in an effort to prevent unfair targeting of de minimus users; and,

A description of how it's, "protecting the rights of individuals from erroneous subpoenas".

"The Senate Governmental Affairs' Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations is reviewing the group's responses and declined to make them available Thursday, as did the industry group," says an AP story in USA Today.

"Surely it was not Congress’ intent when it passed the Digital Millennium Copyright Act to short-circuit due process protections, relegate a U.S. District Court to providing 'rubber-stamp' subpoenas, enable the music industry to collect information about consumers with little or no restrictions, and place numerous average consumers at risk of bankruptcy," Coleman said when he announced that the subcommittee wanted answers from the RIAA.

This I can see happening. Congress shutting down the RIAA because of privacy concerns. I'm keeping an eye on this.

Not only is it readily apparent that the RIAA is out of control, hopefully Colemans actions are just the start of a full investigation of the witch hunt campaign the RIAA has embarked on.

Based on the RIAAs actions, they could care less who they target and sue. They just want to achieve maximum publicity in an attempt to scare people away from p2p, at the expense of grandparents and children.

I really hope this sets a precedent for the government to get involved with these cases and possibly the rewriting of the DMCA, for clearly it was introduced with little thought in regards to the rights of the people.

Thank You Sen. Coleman !

Little thought about the people seams to be the trendy thing as of late. Almost a radical shift giving buisness power and control over the buyer.
I'm very interested in finding out how they try and spin each topic. Most notably the description of how it's, "Protecting the rights of individuals from erroneous subpoenas."

I'm not a techie, so riddle me this batman..
Would it be possible to scan however/whatever the RIAA is using to "break into" computers, and then put that same method to malicious use? If so, then I think it's not a large leap to say that the RIAA would be iin violation of contributory statues, unless they can prove otherwise. Any ideas?
ttmmm

a voice of reason in a of sea babbling doubletalk by the RIAA

I'm sure glad there is a Senator who is not sleeping on this matter. I will take the time to write and thank him!

ISP-Privacy:
Hold the pen for a little while - while it may be vogue for him to take up this cause he has yet to do anything with it. We can only hope there is a bit of common sence and integrity in the congressman so he'll do the right thing and not go with the flow!

Remye,
At this point in time, I don't think there is any evidence that the RIAA is "breaking into" computers. What they are doing is taking advantage as to the information that a p2p client provides. In regards to Kaaza, they can find your kaaza name, your IP address (from your IP adress they get your ISP), and the files you are sharing. This information is generally available to anyone that uses Kaaza, so it can not be considering breaking into anything.

I am sure they are using some third party tools for data collection as well, but the main point being, they don't need to break into a Kaaza PC to find the files. If you share it, they can see it.

It's enough to give me a little faith in the U.S. Judicial system after all.

I have been reading some of the letters that people have been sending to their respective congressmen on Congress.Org concerning the current issues surrounding the RIAA's subpoenas and I urge everyone, who hasn't already done the same, to go to this site and send a letter urging them to take a REAL CLOSE LOOK at this issue , making sure that the very laws n rights ,which they have sworn to uphold and defend , are not being threatened by the RIAA's actions/tactics !

Folks, the music industry as we know it is dying. Reference the historical rhetoric by Amy Weiss, RIAA spokesperson "We're going to sue everybody! It doesn't matter who they are!" Lawsuits aren't cheap, folks. Neither are lawyers. Sure, the RIAA has a lot of money, but as they alienate their customers, that money will eventually dwindle. It is also a sure thing that the first time an average joe who has been bankrupted by these Hitlerites appears on "Oprah" or national TV and airs their plight there will be a huge backlash against the record companies. They're dying people, all we need to do is wait for the corpse to fall over.

"There is only one boss, and he can fire any one of us or all of us from the CEO on down, and that is the customer. All he has to do is take his business elsewhere..." Sam Walton

My only concern here is that Senator Coleman has received responses from the RIAA which I suspect are a big pile of propaganda and outright lies. Since neither of them are making the RIAA's response public, we have no way of verifying or correcting the "information" past on to the senator. I just hope that Senator Coleman is sharp enough to cut through the RIAA's mis-information and see their campaign of intimidation for what it is. Also, I'm sure the RIAA is making a large "donation" (i.e., bribe) to the senator's campaign in "gratitude" for his "assistance" (i.e., promise to quietly drop the matter). We can only hope that the senator has some integrity and respects the will of the public who voted for him.

Sharing files and distribution are two different animals. There are a lot of people making and selling bootleg disks in flea markets across the world. I have seen a lot in this country! These are the ones I would say that could be and should be punished for their crime. But when I file share mp3 music that I already purchased and copied to my hard drive from tapes, reel to reel and lp's that’s not a criminal act. If it is, then go back and search the court records and see if anyone in the last 30 years has been sued for trading their albums, selling them in garage sales, or copying from friends. You see the problem is the RIAA does not want to take the time or money it will cost to investigate the real lawbreakers here. Its easier to lump the whole dam mess under one rule, that way they will kill two birds with one stone. 1try to regain losses from their own bad greedy management 2) hold technology in check until they can figure a new plan of attact to stay in business. they missed the train people and they are running scared!

ARRGGH ! Shiver me timbers ! (LOL) . Playing as a pirate was fun as a kid. Being called one as a grown adult is even funnier. RIAA, you filthy bilge rats ARRGH ! LOLOLOL..

The RIAA is completely out of control. I should be able to minupalate the music I buy without any impedence.

I do use file sharing primarily to share SAVED GAMES from a couple of popular games (NOTE: I dont share the game itself but merely the files I create using the game). I do share some music, mainly independant artists, that I gain authorization from (I do require the artist a that they have a way for consumer to PURCHASE the tape/CD.

If the RIAA continues in this fashion; hacking incidents will increase but will not be against the government or software companies, but against the MUSIC industry. As far as I am concern this is fine as I want to be able to BREAK into music that I BOUGHT!

I fully authorize congress to reinstate the MacCarthy hearings. The Communist Party HAS INFRITRATED! The RIAA is eligible as it is acting like CHINA!

I hope if they are found guilty of treason, that they are to either be executed PUBLICALLY, or deported to CHINA.

isp-privacy:

I agree with what you say, however, whether sharing files and "distribution" are not the same thing legally will have to be determined by a judge or jury. I believe it is part of the argument that the recently subpoenaed "Jane Doe" is making in her lawsuit against the RIAA. It will be very interesting to see how the court views it, but I'm not getting my hopes too high. To end this nonsense it is going to take a serious backlash from the consumer, congressional action, or a big win by one of the telecoms that prevents sharing of customer information. I feel certain that some combination of these will happen in time.

-i said this in the above article too, before i even saw this one. apologies, i'm not trying to spam the boards-

Today is a KEY opportunity to write and have your voice heard by Senator Coleman.

I am thanking him, but that's not all by any stretch of the imagination.

I think it's very important that we ALL utilize this opportunity to contact Senator Coleman. This is no time to sit back and watch. I will be writing him, but I would like to contact him by phone as well.

I think failing to contact him in the next 24-36 hours is missing a prime opportunity to get something important accomplished.

oldfart - ah, nostalgia. The way things used to be. Wal-mart isn't like they were when Sam Walton was alive. Is he also the one that coined the phrase "The customer is always right?" If he didn't, he applied better than anyone ever has.

Fortunately he's right. And we are currently proving that.

Don't just reply to Sen. Coleman, but send letters,e-mails and responses to all of the acting members in cogress concerning this issue. The more we flood them with calls of concern the more attention they will have to pay to this .

Check out Congress.Org . You can write to any one!

The burden of proof to all of the RIAA's claims is on their shoulders. Due process must be followed. To simply submit a subpoena and threaten to sue because of 'copyright infringements causing loss of profits ' without proof could establish a horrific precedent in our judicial system giving corporate America the right to sue consumers for their own failures ! Our elected officials should work for us .NOT THEM !

No, the burden of proof is not the RIAAs. Not only would any actuall court work be a civil case where proof is not required as strictly as a criminal case, but the RIAA can quite easily scare people into settleing without going to court at all.

The civil legal system is already rediculously biased towards the rich by the very high legal fees. Quite often the winner isthe side that can keep feeding the lawyers longest.

I've written to my congressmen and now I've just written to Senator Coleman, for the 2nd time. I hope you all will as well.

I'm afraid there's some truth to what goldenpi says. Unfortunately, with our draconian copyright laws, I don't think the individuals being subpoenaed by the RIAA are going to win. It's going to take a huge consumer backlash, congressional action, or a big win by one of the telecoms to stop the RIAA. I'm optimistic that one or more of these will happen.

I just sent a letter to Coleman, and Mr. Bush! I agree with rightoshare and shermanator
NOW IS THE TIME FOR ALL GOOD MEN TO COME TO THE AID OF THE PARTY!

I posted this on other boards:

These may be some of the ones we should be wrighting to

Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations

Norm Coleman, Chairman
Carl Levin, Ranking Minority Member

Ted Stevens
George V. Voinovich
Arlen Specter
Robert F. Bennett
Peter G. Fitzgerald
John E. Sununu
Richard C. Shelby
Daniel K. Akaka
Richard J. Durbin
Thomas R. Carper
Mark Dayton
Frank Lautenberg
Mark Pryor

isp-privacy,

I am not sure that I see your distinction between sharing files and distribution.

While I agree there is a difference between the two, sharing is simply that, sharing a copywritten work. The distribution at flea markets is done for personal gain.

But if you look at the Fair Use Act (USA), things can get a little fuzzy as to how sharing relates to copyright law.

A very important issue in regards to fair us is related to whether your use of the copywritten material deprives the copywritten owner of income. While I have not seen this yet in court, if fair use is brought up, it could be deemed that sharing is depriving the owner of potential income. This may end up being a hard thing to prove, but if it can be proven to a judge, it will certainly set a bad precedent.

I do agree with you, the RIAA does not want to take the time and the money for sting operations on people bootlegging at fleamarkets. With p2p, and the DMCA, it is much easier for them to track people on p2p networks and simply issue a subpeona. This way, they let a lot of other people do their work for them. They don't have to involve the police, they don't have to place people at locations. Now they can just see one person sharing one file, trace the IP to an ISP, issue a subpeona and let the ISP do the work.

yes metal- man and it has become a very fuzzy world for corrupt greedy business people that can convince judges by the use of their fuzzy greasball HIGH PAID laywers to twist the law to their favor. But lets just hope! there are enough pissed off fed up Americans to cause the biggest uproar you have ever seen. Like I said in previous comments there is not a whole lot of trust in big businesses and CEOs right now. With the number Americans that are out of work and have had their retirement accounts raped and pilaged.....i dont think its going to look to good for them to put too many soccer moms on the stand at this point. Time will tell! But i agree with the others here that we should be blasting congress with every letter you can send on this matter.

"Surely it was not Congress’ intent when it passed the Digital Millennium Copyright Act to short-circuit due process protections, relegate a U.S. District Court to providing 'rubber-stamp' subpoenas, enable the music industry to collect information about consumers with little or no restrictions, and place numerous average consumers at risk of bankruptcy," Coleman said when he announced that the subcommittee wanted answers from the RIAA.
____


Uh...that's exactly what their intent was. Their "intent" was to pass whatever the entertainment industry told them to thanks to the big $$$.

It's time to write YOUR congressmen and tell them that you demand campaign finance reform. Tell them that you are sick of billionare special interests and lobbies buying laws that serve them and only them.

goldenpi:

Wouldn't the RIAA still have to proove that any party they bring to court caused them x amount of dollars in lost sales in order to recieve any monetary reward? Simply showing what someone may have in their share file says nothing.

Or does it??

BLACK OUT!!!!!

metal-man-micro:

It's even worse than that. The Audio Home Recording Act of 1992 allows for "fair use" of digital audio recordings if they are made with digital audio recording devices. According to their narrow definition, a computer does not qualify as a digital audio recording device, and so is not covered under "fair use" protection. It has been argued, therefore, that digital copies of music files (MP3 files created by ripping a CD) made by the user, even one who owns the CD, are not covered by "fair use". Therefore, by this argument, just having these files constitutes copyright infringement. I'm not saying I agree, but I've seen it argued by legally-knowledgeable types. The conclusion: The U.S. copyright laws have become draconian, are not relevant to modern technology, and have to be thrown out and re-written.

this black out will affect a little the sales of cds since there is no ellectricity in the whole fukin (excuse my french) north east.

Righttoshare:

I'm sure that, in court, the RIAA would try to make some projections about how many times a file is likely to be shared and convert that to dollars lost in CD sales. It's total fantasy, of course, but would a judge or jury buy into it? Who knows?

With regard to the distinction between "distribution" and having files available for sharing on a P2P network, would I be liable for copyright infringement if I left my front door open and someone came in stole my backup copies of legally-owned CDs? Same principle, no?

Hold on folks, Coleman is a republican and it is election year....don't get your hopes up that he will help...it may all be a facade.

Here's another copyright loophole that no one has mentioned yet. When we recorded our parody of Neil Young's "Ohio," we did some reasearch to try and determine who actually owned the copyright.

For one thing, we never found out who owns it now (because everything at the Copyright Office prior to 1976 is still on index cards), but we did find the original copyright for the album it was on which was a copyright for an ANALOG recording.

Thjis brings up the question of whether those old recordings are still protected after being converted to another (digital) format. The underlying words and music are, but if you post a digital version of a pre-1976 song that only has analog rights, there may be a valid court argument, just as there is potentially a viable argument that an mp3 is not CD quality, does not contain 90% of the original information and, although it is a derivative work, it is NOT a true copy of the original.

WoW!!! you should be a laywer!

Good thoughts....I'll bet you will see all kinds of loop holes in a copy right law that was written 100 years ago!

To me, the DMA is unconstitutional. To read up on it go here: http://www.gseis.ucla.edu/iclp/dmca1.htm

I thought the copyright law is to protect the composition of the song.
and bar people from writing simular
lyrics and copying the tune of the song.
as far as I know, downloading on the computer is equivilent to recording of the radio. I guest the Digital Millennium Copyright Act killed that off.I understand protecting the composition of the song and that part of the law. the RIAA,CRIA should concentrate on getting bootleggers selling at flea markets and Ebay I hope
subcommittee chairman senator Norm Coleman and his team will get to the bottom of this crap. boy I guest i'm in
deep crap. I was recording off the radio for 28 years, I guest I sould get a subpoena for a billion dollars.

Don't ever take anyone or anything for granted. Don't put all your eggs in one basket either. If they say look to the left, look to the right and vice versa (behind you too) while keeping your *cursor* pointed straight ahead!!! PEDALZ TO THE MEDALZ!!!!!! RIGHT ON! FIGHT ON!!! ROCK AND ROLL WILL NEVER DIE!!! POWER TO THE PEOPLE~OLE BEN FRANKLIN JUST CAME OUT OF HIZ GRAVE!!!

The major labels have been living in the past. Part of what has brought this witch hunt of mp3 file
shares has been poor planning on the part of the music industry itself. Because of its lack of
foresight to do what every other entertainment business has done it has had to hunt and come up
with a scape goat to cover their own butts for the lagging sales. Without that scapegoat, heads
would roll, much the same as any other business that has shareholders who want to see profits so
that the shareholder gets a return for the investment they made.

You see, other entertainment people, such as sports, don't get the major part of their income from
ticket sales. That is the chump change. The money is in the pay tv, public tv, radio, and other forms
of commercial rebroadcast.

What the music majors did was depend on the ticket sales. That purchase of the album or cd. They
depended on the chump change to make their income. What they didn't do was go for a slice of the
ticket sales at concerts, for the endorsements of artists for advertisement, for the commercialism
of group sales in items such as tee shirts sold at concerts. Had this become known to the stock-
holder that the C.E.O's on down to the manager level folks that had doings with contracts and locking
up the artists rights so that only the record company makes the lionshare had missed this one, none
of those in the jobs now would be there. It is not that the lowly file sharer is financially breaking the
big music majors because those huge companies long ago diversified into other business that also
make money. Believe me, they ain't going broke. But it is far easier to point over at that tree and say
it is the fault of that fellow over there than it is to own up to the fact they screwed up.

The RIAA's purpose is to keep a job for everyone at the expense of the artist and the consumer. Their
motto for you, the buyer is, "Shut up and pay up. We want more." We pay for the remastering of an
old music recording, every Joe Blow inbetween that handles the product before it gets to you, and the
store that has it on the shelf. All other business figure out that if times are tight you do something
different. Lord knows we have seen enough of how that works in the the 90's with layoffs galore.

But give the record industry credit. They have figured out a sweet deal to increase profits. Don't lay off,
don't lower the cost of the product or raise the quality. Sue the customer for that lack of profit and while
your at it, blame them too!

Now it doesn't take a wizard to see that peer-to-peer would be a blessing in disguise for them, used properly.
It could reduce the overhead, the middleman, and lower the cost to the consumer. (Something unheard of
in the music business!) No cost for distribution, no cost for recording, no cost for the media, no paying
music stores to see that this favored artist is placed out there where the customer is sure to see it first.

Somehow, every offering of electronic downloading has failed to take this into account. The best offering has
been 79 cents a song on a very weak software platform, with a maze of requirements for the user as to
what they can or can not do with the songs they purchased. Someone, in a post previous to this mentioned
that it is not the new stuff they were interested in. Funny, I am not either. What I am interested in is the old
stuff. That 30 year old music. Lots of what I am interested in isn't on the market. I can not go and buy it
because it is not on the shelf for me to buy. The only way I can get it is through p2p. So tell me, exactly
where I stole money from their pockets? This is a puzzle that for the life of me that I can not figure out.
It isn't that it can not be remastered, repackaged, and sold; it is that it is out of print and is not offered.
You can not make money on products that are not up for sale, unless you are the RIAA...

This is what I think... It's called follow the ole money trail, _SAME GAME_just a different HYDRA HEAD. Where does most of the money come from anyway? The Police because of the F*K*D UP laws (WASHINGTON). So the dopeheads/drunk drivers are busted and have paid their bail/fines~x5, many cases they've lost their $$$$ property and or lives!! ASSETT FORFEITURE is the tool or instument that transfers your property to *THE GOVERNMENT*. It's a civil case vs criminal because they do not have to provide you with a "public pretender" And I kid you not ARMOURED TRUCKS pick up the money from PROBATION FEES! Our parents believed the WAR ON DRUGS was real when the U.S. Government turned out to be the TRUE UNDISPUTED DRUG OVERLORD of THE WORLD. How clever, to have the American People design a war on themselves! No wonder other countries call us stupid! The United States has the largest prison population in the world but hell no problem they keep some people in transit on ROLLING CAGED BUSSES forever! Don't forget CONAIR!!! So this RIAA LIE is really ingenious! Think about it! You don't even have to leave the farm to recieve a VIRTUAL SUPBEONA, it's brilliant! Anklebracelets and webcams are the future of our children if we don't FIGHT THIS WITH ALL WE'VE GOT!!!! GOD BLESS THE PEOPLE IN THE STREETS GOING EVERYWHERE TO TALK TO EVERYONE!!! The "BASTARDS OF GLORY" in Washington just can't wait for crap like this NY thing to happen too so they can slam dunk more of OUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS while the MEDIAS REAL JOB is to DISTRACT US with anything and everything they can! Stay on these threads!!! YOU'VE CREATED A MONSTER!!! Vigilance, truly is the price of Liberty!!!! KICK SOME ASSES!!!!!!
RIGHT ON!! FIGHT ON!!!!!!

OK, exactly how many different industries, companies, individuals, and organizations do these greasy, capped tooth, convertible driving, shirt-unbuttoned-to-expose-the-gold-chains-on-their-hairy-chests yahoos really want to piss off?

We're not supposed to spam the threads. Sorry my above comment was so long too. Btw, I wasn't really asleep~I was in a COMA!!!

INVASION OF PRIVACY -

INVASION OF PRIVACY -

I aplogize for the accidental two posts above it did so when I hit return. Anyway, what I have to say is, what the RIAA is doing is an invasion of your home, your PC, without a search warrant.

isn't it ironic that while the RIAA is watching to make sure I don't download a bunch of songs (that aren't currently available anywhere else), that they don't seem to care that a 10 year old using p2p can download all the free porn they want not to mention the sites where you can download info on bomb-making , racially based hate groups etc.......only in america!

Is CodeWarrior still embarrased for what he said about Asians? Please don't be, come back, we enjoy your comments. I least I do.

one thing:UNREASONABLE SEARCH AND SEISURE

CARPE DIEM!!!