I am away from home this weekend, writing to you from my father's home PC and do not have access to the server data-base until after Monday, so any update I do will be at least a couple days from now.

That gives us time to "hash things out" a bit more.

I started out being too much of a stickler with an overly strict interpretation, but my opinion has changed in light of the evidence and the discussions arguements posted in the previous thread.

For my part, I was convinced. We need to begin that "who to boycott" list with a short tally of these "GOOD-GUY" labels.
Even when the RIAA misleadingly includes them on their massive list of "Distributed Labels of Reporting Companies", an indie label (such as spinART) should not be 'penalized' by us automatically, especially when they have contacted us to dispute the RIAA's claim.

Please discuss further. I will try to get the "who to boycott" list updated in a couple of days. In the meantime, how about giving me your suggestions on how to "word" it all. Design/write what you think the page should say and how it should appear keeping what all we have talked about in mind. (Keep it simple! I am NOT any kind of html guru.)

Shmoo, aka "independentmusician"
of the band Electric Gypsy
& your humble admin
SUPPORT LOCAL AND INDEPENDENT MUSIC!

The information at this site is 4 years old!!

4 years eh ....

Isn't that about the time they STARTED the lawsuits on behalf of the "artists" ?
They have a lot of incentive to keep folks from finding out who are really "members".
this could be really tough.

leflaw, our current "who to boycott" list from the RIAA is only a couple months old. (I updated it myself a while back in response to a few complaints that it was old info.)

But never fear! I am back home from a local bluegrass festival (where I handed out quite a few Boycott-Riaa bumper stickers) and will be doing some work tonight on it after I catch up with the day-to-day stuff.

Ok folks, for the time being (and still subject to change) take a look at the "who to boycott" list and tell me what you think.

Sure, it is not "elegant" and is a quick fix... but it is just for the time being.

YOUR SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENT OF ANYTHING AT BOYCOTT-RIAA ARE ALWAYS BEING SOLICITED SO LONG AS I LIVE HERE! --Shmoo

(Even if I don't particularly always see eye to eye with you!)

Shmoo, I just took a look at "who to boycott". It's pretty awkward. I think you need one more line, a heading, above the non-RIAA record labels that you have listed there.

I have a better idea, Independent. Why don't you just link to the riaa regarding this list? Why is it necessary for you to have your own list, and discuss it? SpinArt has been in contact with you for days, and their still on your list.... What does an independent need to do to be removed from your misleading fuckin list?

More discussion? What?

"I have a better idea, Independent. Why don't you just link to the riaa regarding this list?"
"What does an independent need to do to be removed from your misleading fuckin list?"

According to Spin-Art, The RIAA list is misleading, and incorrect. A simple link in itself will continue to perpetuate mistakes, ( which I thought we were gaining ground in correcting ). It is clear the RIAA wishes to decieve with THEIR "misleading fucking list".

What WAS happening were attempts to verify Spin-Arts status, in a very civil discussion with Erik.
You don't want civil.
Civil isn't cut and dry and simple.

Yes, more discussion.
It will likely continue, regardless of your hateful rhetoric.

I have an better idea ...
Why don't you post CONSTRUCTIVE IDEAS to help solve problems, instead of spiteful rants designed to create problems ?

" Why don't you post CONSTRUCTIVE IDEAS to help solve problems, instead of spiteful rants designed to create problems ?"

*yawn*

I thought I had done so already. SpinART is not affiliated with the RIAA. How much more discussion regarding this need be said before somebody actually says, okay, we'll remove you?

"Please discuss further. I will try to get the "who to boycott" list updated in a couple of days. In the meantime, how about giving me your suggestions on how to "word" it all. Design/write what you think the page should say and how it should appear keeping what all we have talked about in mind. (Keep it simple! I am NOT any kind of html guru.)"

I wonder if this list of yours opens you up for possible lawsuits should the information prove to be inaccurate and can be shown to cause harm....

Now that would be interesting, wouldn't it?

"Now that would be interesting, wouldn't it? "

Yes it would.
Since entries come from the RIAA's own list. The RIAA could ALSO be sued for it, if their inacurate list causes harm.

Could be REAL interesting.

"SpinART is not affiliated with the RIAA. "

SO. They use an RIAA affiliate to distribute their material. They still maintain a business relationship with the RIAA, whether they like it or not. It's not as simple as you'd like to make it seem. Today's world is not a simple YES or NO, as you are trying to make it out to be. That's a politicians attitude "either you are for me or against me". Either you are Repulican or Democrat. This kind of attitude ignores all other possible details in a situation.

A true boycott would eliminate ALL activites with the boycott target. Yet SpinART has had the guts and courage to point out to us that they are not represented by the RIAA and differ with them on many viewpoints. Fine. Let everyone make a decision based on ALL the facts, not just some of them.

INeedALover,

I don't really even know why I waste the time with your stupid ass, but I suppose it's just the way it is....

"SO. They use an RIAA affiliate to distribute their material. They still maintain a business relationship with the RIAA, whether they like it or not. It's not as simple as you'd like to make it seem. Today's world is not a simple YES or NO, as you are trying to make it out to be."

They are an independent label, they are not owned by the riaa. So what does it matter if a distributer (which is not a label) is? It is that simple. They the label, have nothing to do with the riaa. Their distributer may or may not be an riaa member, but that still isn't the label.

"That's a politicians attitude "either you are for me or against me". Either you are Repulican or Democrat. This kind of attitude ignores all other possible details in a situation."

You have serious issues if you think the label discussion has anything to do with politics. You guys have a label on your list to avoid which isn't run by the riaa, isn't owned by the riaa, has nothing directly to do with the riaa.

"A true boycott would eliminate ALL activites with the boycott target. Yet SpinART has had the guts and courage to point out to us that they are not represented by the RIAA and differ with them on many viewpoints. Fine. Let everyone make a decision based on ALL the facts, not just some of them."

What facts moron? SpinART is not affiliated with the riaa. Their distributer might be, but the distributer isn't SpinART. Your blasting SpinART for being with the riaa, when they have infact told you they are not. How many fucking times does someone have to ask to be removed from a boycott list before any of you morons do anything about it? Note, When I say morons, I don't mean all of you; just the majority and you idiots know who you are.

Instead of removing SpinART when they told you they have nothing to do with the riaa, You continued to list them with an asterisk; fine print... That is poor! But then again, I've come to expect almost anything here.

SpinART is what you wanted, an indie label; yet you list them as the enemy. Your such assholes... really.

Raid, you were beaten up on the playground a lot when you were a child, weren't you?

You have my pity.

"I don't really even know why I waste the time with your stupid ass, but I suppose it's just the way it is.... "

We don't know either, since we are so clearly beneath you.

Once again .. I have an EVEN BETTER idea.
Since you have so many marvelous suggestions as to how schmoo needs to run this site, why don't YOU, instead of wasting so much of your precious time attempting to educate us derned idiots, create and run your OWN RIAA themed website, according to your significantly higher standards ?
Call it Boycott-RIAA-sux-roks.com or
somesuch, as your opinion is your right.

Stop wasting your time with the likes of us. We are too stupid to ever appreciate the cleverness of you.

"What facts moron? "

The only fact I mentioned, that they use an RIAA distributor. Only an idiot like yourself would have missed that one.

"Your blasting SpinART for being with the riaa.." Oh really? How is saying "SpinART has had the guts and courage to point out to us that they are not represented by the RIAA " blasting them?? Obviously you must not be intelligent enough to read, or you wouldn't have stated such an obvious dumb ass remark.

Why don't you crawl back into the hole you came out of?? Your comments only serve to show how stupid you really are.

Lets see here SpinArt is an indie label and has no affiliation with the RIAA just their distrbution channels Hmmmmm.

How about having a radio button that says goodguys and list them. then hyper link each one with a short bio listing all the things the average joe needs to know including the distribution channels highlighting the fact that they are not affilliated with the RIAA.
Then you could possibly E-mail each business with some info if you know of any independent distibuters with a good track record to help them off of the RIAA distribution channels.

Why doesn't SpinART state the fact on their website, that they are not affiliated, and are improperly listed on the RIAA site.

GoKart Records has done this, and there not even on the RIAA list.

"Why doesn't SpinART state the fact on their website, that they are not affiliated, and are improperly listed on the RIAA site.

GoKart Records has done this"

Because GoKart is trying to sell to a certain type of person. The "we are not with the RIAA" stance of GoKart appeals to the consumer that GoKart is trying to capture. It is a marketing device for GoKart. SpinART is marketing to a different group of people than GoKart.

"SpinART is what you wanted, an indie label; yet you list them as the enemy."

Agreed. I guess the only artists acceptable are people making music in their basement and selling cdr's that they burn on their Gateway computers and sell on myspace.com.

mroop, what are you thinking?!? TRUE indies only use Macs! Duh!

INeedALover,

"The only fact I mentioned, that they use an RIAA distributor. Only an idiot like yourself would have missed that one."

Erm...Actually....

"SO. They use an RIAA affiliate to distribute their material. They still maintain a business relationship with the RIAA, whether they like it or not."

They do not maintain a business relationship with the RIAA. They have a business relationship with a distributer that may or may not be an RIAA member. One distributer is not the riaa.

"A true boycott would eliminate ALL activites with the boycott target. Yet SpinART has had the guts and courage to point out to us that they are not represented by the RIAA and differ with them on many viewpoints. Fine. Let everyone make a decision based on ALL the facts, not just some of them."

" Obviously you must not be intelligent enough to read, or you wouldn't have stated such an obvious dumb ass remark."

Are you high or something today? Their is no decision anyone here needs to make aside from the administration correcting the error. FYI, I have to be able to read to write software, idiot. http://bughunter.atspace.org

"Why don't you crawl back into the hole you came out of?? Your comments only serve to show how stupid you really are."

While I realize many of you here have the flamewar skills of a 5th grader, I try to overlook it.

Dreddsnik,

" We don't know either, since we are so clearly beneath you."

Clearly beneath me? At what point did I say such a thing?
You really do have mental issues eh? Inferiority complex or something?

" Once again .. I have an EVEN BETTER idea.
Since you have so many marvelous suggestions as to how schmoo needs to run this site, why don't YOU, instead of wasting so much of your precious time attempting to educate us derned idiots, create and run your OWN RIAA themed website, according to your significantly higher standards ?"

Wait.. Schmoo invited this "discussion" and requested "suggestions and ideas". I provided some, as he had asked. As far as educating goes, While I realize INeedALover and yourself are hopelessly going to remain stupid as far as technology is concerned, I still have hope that others who lurk on this site are not as technologically impaired as you.

Raid, when was the last time you clicked on the "who to boycott" link?

"I have to be able to read to write software, idiot. "

Gee, you could have fooled me.

INeedALover,

"Gee, you could have fooled me."

Are you kidding me? Did you even look at the url? Jeeze...

Lachatte,

"Raid, when was the last time you clicked on the "who to boycott" link?"

It's been a few days.

The information on this site is for the most part stale. (When's the last time the Rogues Gallery was updated, Hmm? Hatch and Bainwol aren't listed.)

If a minor label such as SpinART is listed on the GonoRIAA site, time should at least be taken to perform a full background check.

You can't trust lobbyist organization for anything, remember?

Need help programming?

DarkHorseX,

This site doesn't background check at all. They have self proclaimed wannabe lawyers, wannabe pseudo computer experts.. ad nausem. It's pretty infantile.

They preach indie indie indie, and you see how they treat their own kind.

"Raid, you were beaten up on the playground a lot when you were a child, weren't you?"

Not really, no. I'm fast.

"You have my pity."

I don't think I need an unknown end-users pity, thanks all the same, l0ser.

Raid Back off.

Welcome fugazzi.

"TRUE indies only use Macs! Duh!"

Hipster alert!

"Not really, no. I'm fast."

Funny. : )

nitedreamerxp,

"Raid Back off."

Relax dude. I'm just having a little fun.

RaidHHI, you might want to click that "who to boycott" link. (It was updated 2 or 3 days ago.)

As "mean" as you sometimes seem to be, I have come around quite a bit to your way of thinking since this whole thing got started.

I could word it a little better, but for now, I think it almost exactly reflects your suggestions.

Close enough for horseshoes and hand-grenades and rock and roll anyway.

FROM THE INBOX:
=========

"Where do Boycott-RIAA members draw the line? How far does the boycott extend?

What about license arrangements? This comes to mind due to the recent hullabaloo over spinART being indie but disbtributed by a company who reports its sales to the RIAA. There are also the rare agreements where the artist owns their work but licenses it to a major for worldwide distribution. One group that comes to mind is Toto. Yes, I have been a fan of them for years, and was happy to see them break free from Sony. The copyright on their 2002 Through The Looking Glass CD (album of covers) states Toto Recordings, Inc. Under exclusive licence to CMC Records (a division of EMI). This would mean that Toto controls their music, and how it is distributed, but that EMI would share in some of the profit.

If one were to truly boycott the RIAA, there would be a number of products, services, and companies to avoid (not just music labels). First, you have the fast food chains who offer downloads and CDs as promotional items. They are also associated with the MPAA as they are always doing movie deals with the major studios. Second, there are
several products and services, which advertise on TV using RIAA backed tunes. These include cars, beverages, hotels, and more. There are many chain stores that stock RIAA products, including places where people grocery shop, if you know what I mean. Finally, you have book publishers, who have associations with the RIAA, once you trace the path. One of the major book and magazine publishers has a parent company who recently joined forces with a music giant. Of course, I am talking about Random House, which is owned by Bertelsmann AG.

Just some food for thought."

======

Exactly. We must all ultimately decide for ourselves on where that "line" is. I personally choose to be very strict about it. (This "spinArt" debacle shows that I perhaps am TOO strict about it. Even George/gdZiemann said something to the effect that I should give spinArt a "passing grade" ...and I believe that now myself after learning a bit more about that indie label.)

But I don't think it is my place to draw any lines for anyone other than myself. I only give my own opinions. Opinions which ARE subject to change based on the things I learn from all of you!

Boycott-Riaa does not set RULES per-se. We teach each other what we know and learn along the way. I like to think that we are metamorphic and adaptable as new info arrives.

Our "job" is to convince each other, NOT to dictate absolutes.

RAID - "SpinART is what you wanted, an indie label; yet you list them as the enemy. Your such assholes... really."

Any chance for an apology to the members of this site? What you said is just not true and you should know it. Almost everyone here is trying to be fairminded and all we get from you is shit.

You paint with a mighty wide brush and to be honest I'm getting sick and tired of it.

Raid ,
I'm sorry I jumped fast at ya it's just I care about everyone here including you it's like family bickering at the table lol. carry on.

pinemikey,

"Any chance for an apology to the members of this site? What you said is just not true and you should know it. Almost everyone here is trying to be fairminded and all we get from you is shit."

An apology for what? It's taken days to get this mess sorted out. And if spinart hadn't bothered to contact this site's admins, the list would still be inaccurate.

I guess its got more to do with me then anything else. I'm always in favor of uptodate information, not outdated information.

You don't always get shit from me, only when you ask/invite it. I'm not the hardass your trying to paint me as... I just have a low tolerance for stupid things, and stupid people.

"You paint with a mighty wide brush and to be honest I'm getting sick and tired of it."

I don't paint. I make observations in a cynical sort of way. My odd sense of humour does tend to offend some, but I'm not going to lose sleep over it.
I've gotten sick over some things here before, I tend not to let it bother me as much. End users are always going to be end users. No helping them.

Poor little Raid...

...constantly lashing out at everyone...

...got to bring everyone else down so he can feel superior.

"TRUE indies only use Macs! Duh!"

"Hipster alert!"

It was sarcasm, dude. Then again, I can't blame you. Around here who can tell sarcasm from serious.

NoWayRIAA,

"Poor little Raid..."

Very amusing... Are we still in school?

"...constantly lashing out at everyone..."

Ahh.. One sign of a person with problems, not being able to read. I almost feel sorry for you. Almost.


"...got to bring everyone else down so he can feel superior."

bring you down to feel superior? Laugh fuckin laugh. I already am superior.
Nah, but on a serious note; what is the point in all this? Are you yet another end-user in need of a good schooling or what?

"It was sarcasm, dude. Then again, I can't blame you. Around here who can tell sarcasm from serious."

As I said, you have serious issues.

"Very amusing... Are we still in school?"

You tell me, I assumed you were with your childish, immature antics.

"I already am superior."

This has been your attitude all along...and it's why most folks around here don't take you seriously...most of the time anyway.

Obviously, you retreat to the cyber world so that you can at least pretend to be somebody. It seems pretty obvious that, in the real world, you are nothing.

You don't want my pity...okay...I'll waste no more time on you.

NoWayRIAA,

"You tell me, I assumed you were with your childish, immature antics."

And those would be? Seriously...

"This has been your attitude all along...and it's why most folks around here don't take you seriously...most of the time anyway."

It's a bit funny for you to comment on sarcasm when you yourself can't see it.

With regard to taking me seriously, Shrug, You don't have too. Many people on the net already have... LoL. I'm exactly what I said I was originally. Just an old school Hacker who does understand that ripping cds and releasing the results isn't covered under the AHRA. This seems to be a problem for many of you. So I don't mind it too much that i'm not favored in a good way here. Besides, most of you appear to be end-users. I deal with enough stupidity at work, It annoys me to find it here sometimes.

"Obviously, you retreat to the cyber world so that you can at least pretend to be somebody. It seems pretty obvious that, in the real world, you are nothing."

In the words of a teacher I once had speaking to another pseudo wannabe student concerning my computer knowledge, "Don't bother kiddo, he's already forgotten more then your ever going to learn." The cyber world.. I like that cute 90s/00s buzzword. I'm exactly the same in real life as I am here, I don't pretend to be someone else. My credits are just as valued in the so called "real world" as they are online. Very little difference, since computers are not a hobby for me, but a profession. Oops.

My software speaks for itself, the good stuff as well as the antisocial programs I've written. That reputation isn't just online, it's very much in the real world. Security persons take people like me very seriously, and with good reason.

Besides, rolling stones magazine is a real world item, Did they ever publish anything about you? No? No surprise, your not even relevant in the real world.

Sounds close enough to me, Raid...but jeez, the insults just takes away from the message. Besides if it wasn't for a different direction at the high school level, quite a few "end users" might just be fellow programers instead.

It would seem to me that complaining about end users is sort of like me complaining about how stupid oil companies are and wondering why they don't just go away, yet they are the main instigators of offshore oil development..thereby causing the need for offshore oil drilling platforms...making a lifetime job for me.

"...most of you appear to be end-users."

You keep calling everyone "end-users," like it's some kind of derogatory remark. I assume by end-users you mean individuals who only use software as opposed to those who write software, including yourself in the latter category.

I've got news for you. You are an "end-user" as well...and that sheep doesn't appreciate the way you've been "using" his "end."

"I just have a low tolerance for stupid things, and stupid people."

How can you stand to be around yourself? You have a really messed up way of determining who's stupid.

Sorry, I just have a low tolerance for arrogant, know-it-all, self-important, braggarts.

You are always so fond of pointing out that you are so much better than everyone else because you are proud to admit that you are breaking the law instead of trying to justify it. Most folks don't think being a criminal is something of which to be proud.

pinemikey,

"Sounds close enough to me, Raid...but jeez, the insults just takes away from the message. Besides if it wasn't for a different direction at the high school level, quite a few "end users" might just be fellow programers instead."

I see why you and I didn't see eye to eye before. Your talking about monkeys, not coders. You won't learn low level bios calls, master boot record layout and design, ntfs file system marking routines, direct video memory access in high school or in college for that matter. Show me a college kid who can write a polymorphic virus without stealing the source code to one of ours.

Nah man, I didn't learn to program in highschool, I've been programming for a long long time, way before computers were "cool". Your talking about monkeys, not coders. Coding is an art. It's the ability to make a computer do damn near anything YOU want it too, whether it should or not. Your not limited by much, aside from your skill and imagination.

"'ve got news for you. You are an "end-user" as well...and that sheep doesn't appreciate the way you've been "using" his "end."

Hmm.. I think you just answered my question about your level of education quite nicely.

"Sorry, I just have a low tolerance for arrogant, know-it-all, self-important, braggarts."

Yes indeedy, as I suspected; a fucking high school kid. I wouldn't be surprised if your accessing this site via an aol account.

know it all do I? I don't correct mroop concerning the law, He's a lawyer, not me. I do know some about the laws concerning copyright, so what? I'm a registered author of various software actually used in the real world. What have you accomplished? Not a damn thing eh? Since you missed the train, I'll explain a few things to you.

First, I've been professionally employed now for over 16 years or so in this industry...

Second, I hold various certifications that cost me alot of money for a nifty piece of paper; which didn't teach me much besides. I don't think I've even brought that up, didn't see a need for it. Yet you call me a braggart. I've been straight up with everyone here since my first post. Nobody will tell you I'm proud of the viruses I wrote, but I am proud of the knowledge I gained coding them. If I'm arrogant for seeking knowledge, then I can live with that.

Third, Computers are not a hobby for me, they are my life. I breathe computers, electronics. I always have. This isn't some highschool kid trying to impress anybody here. My software, both good and bad speaks for itself.

Fourth, I have not, ever, ever claimed to know it all about anything. I'm very intelligent, sure; You could be too someday, who knows. It's certainly not a bad thing to be educated.

"You are always so fond of pointing out that you are so much better than everyone else because you are proud to admit that you are breaking the law instead of trying to justify it. Most folks don't think being a criminal is something of which to be proud."

Up until now, I haven't discussed anything besides copyright laws, and various misinterpretations of what some people here seem to think is fair use. It's not fair use to play music loud enough for the neighborhood, no. That's pointing out i'm better in what way? I run a ripping group, does that make me better? I violate copyright everyday if I can. I have no desire to justify copyright infringement, no. I don't think the riaa is entirely out of line, either.

Theres this thing I was taught when I was young, that so many people these days don't even know the meaning of. And that's respect. I can look at myself in the morning and know I didn't cheat myself or lie to myself. I know copying the cd is illegal, I don't try to claim it should be okay because I can't take care of it.

Some history for your punkass, it was illegal to help a black man, or hide him from his owners not so long ago.... Just because your a criminal for something, doesn't automatically make it bad. Criminal is a cute word for those who won't follow like a dumb sheep.. You know all about sheeps tho don't you, kiddo? Hah...

Why don't you save yourself some time and misery man, read some other articles where I have or haven't posted. Before you try playing games, okay? I'm not so bad, honest. I'm a fairly nice guy. I just have a low tolerance for bullshit. I am intelligent, I don't feel sorry for that. I paid dearly for the knowledge I have, I earned it.

Sorry, nice try, but you are way off base...just like I'm sure you are about most of the folks who post on this site. One minute I'm chastised for using 90s jargon...the next I'm a high-schooler...nice work Sherlock.

So you've devoted your entire life to computers and know all there is to know about them? Good for you, bud. Too bad that didn't leave you any time for living a real life. Wow, all that computer knowledge and you choose to spend your time hangin' around here, berating us "losers." I guess this place lets you single out technical topics that you can pick on everyone about. Meanwhile, you are so emersed in computers, you would probably have your ass handed to you debating over any real world issues.

I've gotta hand it to you, though. Even though you sacrificed almost every moment of your life to worship at the "keyboard" altar, you still managed to find time to work up an impressive level of pathological narcissism.

Monkeys vs coders? Dude, you should really see a therapist...and maybe unplug long enough to...I don't know...get a tan...go on a date or something...let out some of that pent up anger and frustration...let the carpal tunnel syndrome heal a little from all those years of "coding"...oh, sorry..."creating art."

Oh, and believe me, I've read plenty of the articles where you have posted. Maybe you should go back and read them yourself. Put yourself in the place of those whom you have belittled for their lack of knowledge on narrow subject for which you profess to have vast knowledge. You treat people worse than you may realize. You seem to believe that, unless a person knows everything there is to know about a subject, they should not discuss it at all...if you're not an expert then don't bother. You have a low tolerance for what you consider to be stupidity. I have a low tolerance for small-mindedness...impatience...a total lack of empathy...and INtolerance.

But, just so you know, I don't really believe you ARE all that bad. You have made some solid contributions and provided some helpful information from time to time...when you can control yourself long enough to keep from putting others down. I, on the other hand, mainly lurk, read and occassionally throw in a comment here or there when I feel compelled to, although it doesn't really amount to much. I'm happy for the success you've had in your beloved profession. I'm also sorry that someday the feds will be kicking down your door, hauling you off to prison and taking away everything you hold dear.

Have a nice day.

I'm not a monkey nor am I a teenager but you could say I'm a learner with training wheels lol.

I am self taught I started with windows 3.1 then went on to every other verion of windows to 2003 family server.

Used apple a little got bored with that.

Then a friend introduced me to linux and it blew me away. been going in several directions with it since.

NoWayRIAA,

"So you've devoted your entire life to computers and know all there is to know about them? Good for you, bud. Too bad that didn't leave you any time for living a real life. Wow, all that computer knowledge and you choose to spend your time hangin' around here, berating us "losers.""

You have a serious fucking problem with me don't ya? Heh.

"Oh, and believe me, I've read plenty of the articles where you have posted. Maybe you should go back and read them yourself. Put yourself in the place of those whom you have belittled for their lack of knowledge on narrow subject for which you profess to have vast knowledge."

profess? Hehehe.. You can look up anything I've told you, if you like. I have no problems with it. Feel fuckin free. Facts are facts... It doesn't matter what I claim, it only matters what I can prove. And, I do take a certain twisted amount of pleasure in proving things. Oh, to see the look on a persons face when they read up on me, and find out.. Oops, so he's not a troll.. Haha, it reminds me of my days long ago when I was bored and would root boxes for fun. Mostly, I'd leave notes on your desktop, but if you really pissed me off, I'd probably grab any serial #'s you had for installed software, then backup and remove your enum key from the registry. Anyone half way decent with troubleshooting could have fixed it, but many users are clueless.

It's a tradeoff I suppose.. I can 0wn pretty much anything and anyone, since computers are ever so friendly to me.... The side effect as I'm sure you've noticed is a very low amount of patience.

"Meanwhile, you are so emersed in computers, you would probably have your ass handed to you debating over any real world issues."

I don't think so. I'm well aware of whats going on in the real world... I don't have my head in the sand, thanks.

"I have a low tolerance for small-mindedness...impatience...a total lack of empathy...and INtolerance."

I'm very open minded. But, I do not have empathy.. You got me there. impatience, yep.. said so several times... I suppose you and I simply will continue to disagree then. I don't know you well enough yet to form an opinion of you.. but I'm sure it won't take long.

nitedreamerxp,

"I am self taught I started with windows 3.1 then went on to every other verion of windows to 2003 family server."

Windows? hehehehe... Nevermind.
Do you remember cp/m? Probably before your time.

Oops.. One final point... Concerning the feds, I'm retired. As in, Ex-Vxer.. as in, I don't do it anymore. They can't touch me for that. hehehe...

Concerning ripping, ah well; you see, it's not a commercial thing, we don't have thousands of burners and piles and piles of cds laying around. Besides, the feds.. hahaha.. shit....

I'm more concerned with the FCC then I am the feds.

"Haha, it reminds me of my days long ago when I was bored and would root boxes for fun. Mostly, I'd leave notes on your desktop, but if you really pissed me off, I'd probably grab any serial #'s you had for installed software, then backup and remove your enum key from the registry."

"I can 0wn pretty much anything and anyone..."

No comments necessary. This tells us all we need to know.

NoWayRIAA,

"No comments necessary. This tells us all we need to know."

Hah... I haven't mislead anyone here about myself, dude. Your the newbie here, not me.

Anyways, as much as I enjoy discussion with stupid people, I must cut back on it.

Have a good one.

Raid,
I've never used cp/m it was befor I could even get my hands on a computer. Thats why I started with win 3.1 you still had to use the command line somewhat but the win GUI pretty much took over by then.