TALLAHASSEE, Fla. - Touchscreen voting machines in 11 counties have a software flaw that could make manual recounts impossible in November's presidential election, state officials said.

A spokeswoman for the secretary of state called the problems "minor technical hiccups" that can be resolved, but critics allege voting officials wrongly certified a voting system they knew had a bug.

The electronic voting machines are a response to Florida's 2000 presidential election fiasco, where thousands of punchcard ballots were improperly marked. But the new machines have brought concerns that errors could go unchecked without paper records of the electronic voting.

The machines, made by Election Systems & Software of Omaha, Neb., fail to provide a consistent electronic "event log" of voting activity when asked to reproduce what happened during the election, state officials said.

Officials with the company and the state Division of Elections said they believe they can fix the problem by linking the voting equipment with laptop computers. Florida's two largest counties — Miami-Dade and Broward — are among those affected by the flaws.

Rep. Robert Wexler, D-Fla., has asked state Attorney General Charlie Crist to investigate whether the head of the state elections division lied under oath when he denied knowing of the computer problem before reading about it in the media. A spokeswoman for Crist said he was reviewing the request.

The elections chief, Ed Kast, abruptly resigned Monday, saying he wanted a change of pace.

During a May 17 deposition for a lawsuit Wexler filed seeking to require a paper trail for state voting machines, Kast said he had recently heard of the problem only days earlier. But in a letter to Crist, Wexler said the Miami-Dade Election Reform Coalition, a citizens' group, notified Kast and Secretary of State Glenda Hood of the glitch in March.

Hood blamed Miami-Dade Supervisor of Elections Constance Kaplan for the delay, telling Kaplan in a May 13 letter she should have notified state officials when she learned of the problem in June 2003.

Nonetheless, state and county election officials insist the problem can be resolved in the five months before the November election.

"These are minor technical hiccups that happen," said Hood spokeswoman Nicole DeLara. "No votes are lost, or could be lost."

Wexler and coalition members said they want to know how the state can be sure that glitches will not prevent elections officials from even detecting computer malfunctions.

"How do you know that any votes were lost if your audit is wrong?" asked Lida Rodriguez-Taseff, chairwoman of the Miami-Dade coalition.

State officials say there is no need for recounts, or an audit trail, with the touchscreen system because it was designed to prevent people from voting in the same race more than once — an overvote — and provide multiple alerts to voters to warn them when they are skipping a race — an undervote.

They emphasize that the "glitch" in the touchscreen machines occurs when the audit is done after the election, not when the tally sheet is printed in each precinct when polls close.




Saturday, June 12, 2004 Associated Press,

THERE IS NO RECOUNT

with electronic voting unless some kind of hard-copy is created at the time of the vote.

If you push recount on some machine without the hard copy, it just will repeat the same fucking mistake. Wheres the new count? There isn't one because theres only an electronic record.

great way for some politicians to take advantage and get re-elected via the supreme court...

It was bound to happen. Does anybody really think the pieces of shit we type on all day at work and at home really are reliable enough for such an important function? Go back to what you had and just try harder to be fair. Tough call, since there are seemingly so many people who want to rig an election one way or the other.

I submitted an article on the official stance of the League of Women Voters on e-voting a couple of days ago and the disagreement within that group. I guess the admins didn't find it relevant. It's at commondreams.org and also here:
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5183090

Here is hoping Bush and his kind don't do it again. Let's make him a one term kind of guy and send him back to where ever he is from behind his gates.
Still Pickin'
Bill H.

Google Diebold and Swarthmore - there's more to this.

Looks to me like bush is making sure the election will end up in the electoral colledge again to me..........hmmm.......isnt it just soooo convenient that brother jeb happens to be governor of florida.

If this election goes back to the electoral colledge again the people of this great country will not be pleased........we the people are the ones that should be making the choice of who our president not a small group of people who would be representing only a small portion of the nations population.

I for one would be calling for the impeachment process to begin if the electoral colledge gets involved again in this election and bush wins again by less than the popular vote.

I'm tired of watching our freedom slowly slip away into the darkness to be replaced by censorship and threat of imprisonment........first they attack religion and freedom of speech......next they will be shipping us off to prisons for speaking out against the government.

As far as i am concerned the U.S. government is swaying more and more towards communistic rule by the day.......isnt it against the law in communist countrys to display anything publicly that mentions religion?

Here's a perfect example!
The words enscribed on the WW2 memorial

"Yesterday, December 7, 1941-- a date which will live in infamy--
the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked."
One woman read the words aloud: " With confidence in our armed forces,
with the unbounding determination of our people, we will gain the
inevitable triumph."

And the part of the speech they removed from history....."so help us God."

Freedom of religion was one of the most important freedoms that our founding fathers gave us.......why do we let these politicians trample our freedom like this???!!!!

A number of articles and editorials about the elections are available from the table on the left at this site:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040612/ap_on_el_pr/florida_voting_machines_1

I think there is more going on then just a right winged conspiracy. If people can't follow and arrow and punch a hole in a piece of paper then how will they be able to operate a computer voting machine.

dispite what we may think of Bush our forefathers framed the constitution with the electorial college so that there would still be a legal election even though there was no majority. they recognized that in a truely free society with elections it may be impossible to have a 50% majority when more than two people are running. If you limit it to two people we no longer have a free republic. We all are seeing our rights slipping away and the two party system is contributing to it.

the election was not stolen. every recount, except one, showed Bush as the winner in Florida. The US supreme court decided (rightly so) in a 7 to 2 vote that the supreme court of florida violated the US constitution in it's decision. two of the seven justices felt there was still time to correct it, the other five disagreed. It really destresses me to hear how Bush stole the election and that the system broke down and that the justices are accused of playing politics just because a decision didn't go the way some would want it to. The system DID work just the way our fore fathers intended. A president was elected without a civil war, or killing and the constitution was followed to the letter. so lets GET OVER IT and move forward.

BTW I will not be voting for Bush or Kerry least anyone think I'm a right wing defender of the pres.

Probably a better case could be made that Kennedy stole the election in 1960 than for Bush stealing the election in 2000.

What else could the Supreme Court have decided? The FL Supremes authorized a recount with different standards in different counties. Is that fair? Is that constitutional? How could the US Supreme Court endorse an atrocity like that from the overwhelmingly Democrat-dominated Florida Supreme Court?

Regardless, post-election recounts funded by a consortium of mostly liberal news organizations found that Bush would still have won by the slimmest of margins. The Republicans should have their own version of Moveon.org to counter the Democrats who just can't get over the fact that their candidate legally lost the electoral vote, though winning the popular vote. And they insist on claiming the presidency was stolen. Well, no more stolen than John F. Kennedy's election, with all the shenanigans in Chicago. The only difference was, Richard Nixon had the class not to bring a lawsuit, but rather graciously accepted defeat, and lived to fight and win another day. But that is another story.

Al lost. Move on, people.

I really don't think I am going to vote for Bush, either. (Or Kerry.) But facts are stubborn things.

How could the US Supreme Court endorse an atrocity like that from the overwhelmingly Democrat-dominated Florida Supreme Court?

I agree with you 100% autodidact but allow me to expand that statement a little further.

How could the US Supreme Court endorse an atrocity like that from ANY state Supreme Court reguardless who controls it?

Autodidact: It's not just about the people who did vote in Florida, it's about the people who were PREVENTED from voting in Florida. However, I'm not hung up about the results of the 2000 election.
I'm concerned about the 2004 election.
There is a counter site: it's http://www.moveover.org/

Also, for all the political people out there, there is a good contrast between Reagan and Bush in this article:
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0609-12.htm

lachatte that's true and also controversal. I really don't know how people were prevented from voting when all they had to do was follow an arrow and punch a hole. my daughter was 14 at the time and saw the ballot on TV and cried out "that's easy". I think reguardless of what technique is used there will be those who get confused for one reason or another. I think the answer isn't getting a new modern system in, it's getting enough workers at the polling stations to help and answer questions. it's a bipartisan issue.

there were issues with absentee ballots because of postage and polling stations closing early etc... but that's a constant in every election.

Vote early, vote often.......

Yea what about the disenfranchise Democrat voters, that were not allowed to vote. Because the state said they had a criminal record. Which they did not have.

mmnuc3,

the only vote that counts is the electoral college.
http://www.archives.gov/federal_register/electoral_college/votes/2000.html

Bush 271
Gore 266

and the Supreme Court put a stop to Gore's foolish attempt to change election law AFTER the election was held.

It cracks me up after all these years, folks STILL crying that Gore lost.

Well, personally, I think we should prevent a lot more people from voting. Number one, I absolutely believe there should be a literacy test. Why should anyone who is not minimally competent at reading and writing be in a position to choose the most powerful leader on earth? This would eliminate the vast majority of idiots who cannot follow an arrow pointing to a hole and punch it.

Two, proof of legal residency should be required. I suppose people do show residency, but that is not the same as legal residency. A valid birth certificate, perhaps?

Three, no convicted felons should vote, unless they have had their convictions reversed or if they are pardoned.

Nah, I don't think the problem lies with people being prevented from voting. The problem lies in too many who are not or should not be legally entitled to vote.

Well then who decides autodidact? There are some out there that cannot read or write. I have a friend who teaches them to do so but that does not mean that they are dumb, far from it. Hell look at Bush, when one hears him talk, well makes one think.
Crossing my fingers that we get this whole bunch out of the white house.
Still Pickin'
Bill Hudson

It's not that Bush won or Gore lost. It is what happen in Fla. that gets me. I think if Gore won his home state, it would not have mattered in Fla. But what happen down there should not have happen at all.

autodidact the literacy test was applied in the south after the civil war to prevent blacks from voting since most freed slaves did not know how to read. that was struck down. I think they need more workers and volenteers at the ballot places to answer questions and help those who need help voting. I do agree about following the arrow. I saw a congressman and other well educated officials during the whole florida fiasco stand up with the ballot in their hands saying it was confusing to them too.

"Three, no convicted felons should vote, unless they have had their convictions reversed or if they are pardoned."

...Uh, you better define what a felon is carefully tho. Sure, an evil ax-murdering child rapist or a government official bribing racketeer should be denied a right to vote (at least till proven rehabilitated) ...but what about a convicted "file-sharer" or someone who had too much weed stashed under the seat when the cop pulled them over?

And the problem is not that too many people vote... the problem is that not enough citizens are REQUIRED to vote.
Even if you don't like the candidates on the ballot, you should still go to the polls and write in someone you DO like. It really DOES matter that you do so, even if you think you have only a snowball's chance in hell.

Just my 2 cents

Shmoo

And yeah, it is a shame that not everyone can read, but that is NOT a good test for eligibility. Autodidact, I don't think a fair "test" would be feasable even though I know what you are actually driving at. Folks should be educated on the issues they are voting for instead of just following party lines. But any "test" would only be abused by either side to discriminate in the favor of that party.

billhudson...when it comes to voting, your vote don't count IF YOU DONT FUCKING VOTE! I'm sick and tired of hearing the whining about Florida, and about 2000 election. Get on with youe life. register to vote and vote. If you don't participate you have no right to bitch.